In this episode of the Versioning Show, Tim and David are joined by Vitaly Friedman, founder and Editor-in-Chief of Smashing Magazine. Vitaly takes Tim and David by the hand as they circumnavigate the world of the early web, freelancing, founding an online magazine, amazing free wallpapers, classic failures, editorial guidelines, and the mysterious haunts of foreign writers.
在Versioning Show的这一集中，Tim和David与Smashing Magazine的创始人兼总编辑Vitaly Friedman一起参加了会议。 维塔利(Vitaly)牵着蒂姆(Tim)和大卫(David)绕过早期的网络世界，自由职业，创立在线杂志，惊人的免费壁纸，经典失败，编辑指南以及外国作家的神秘困扰。
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Facebook上的Smashing Magazine： facebook.com/smashmag
the Japanese concept of Wabi-sabi
日本的Wabi-sabi概念
VML
VML
Shockwave
冲击波
Vitaly’s web-developer’s handbook
Vitaly的网络开发人员手册
Writing For Smashing Magazine
为粉碎杂志写作
Smashing Magazine’s Publishing Policy
粉碎杂志的出版政策
Smashing’s authors guidelines
Smashing的作者指南
Behind The Scenes: What It Takes To Publish A Smashing Article
幕后花絮：发布热门文章需要什么
Smashing’s experts panel
粉碎专家小组
Smashing Conf
粉碎会议
A List Apart
一份清单
SitePoint
SitePoint
SitePoint’s Web channel
SitePoint的网络频道
Pony Foo
小马
CSS-Tricks
CSS技巧
Say hello on Twitter: @mdavidgreen | @tevko | @versioningshow | @sitepointdotcom
在Twitter上问好： @mdavidgreen | @tevko | @versioningshow | @sitepointdotcom
At some point I watched this show, which made a very profound influence on me actually, where there was a guy — a little child — with his grandfather … He said that, Every single day, me and my grandfather, we are traveling around the world, because it’s a circle.
在某个时候，我观看了这个节目，它实际上对我产生了深远的影响，那里有一个男孩-一个孩子-和他的祖父……他说， 每天，我和祖父，我们都在环游世界。世界，因为它是一个圆圈。
Basically crossing the entire world in one day. And I thought, Well, maybe this is even possible. I mean, they had a very small village, so they couldn’t go anywhere, so the grandfather invented this story and he would actually invent little worlds around the village so they would walk through once in the North, once in the South, and so on, and they would change direction a little bit. They would kind of make a full circle around the world.
基本上一天就能穿越整个世界。 我想， 也许这甚至有可能。 我的意思是，他们有一个很小的村庄，所以他们什么也去不了，所以祖父发明了这个故事，他实际上会在村庄周围创造出一些小世界，这样他们就可以在北部一次穿过，在南部一次穿过，等等，它们会稍微改变方向。 他们将在全世界范围内转圈。
I believed that at some point, and I felt like I could change the world the same way.
我相信这一点，并且我觉得我可以以同样的方式改变世界。
Then at some point, right now — and this is like the happiest moment of my life I think — is the point when I gave up on perfection altogether. I think it’s even more important to not be perfect, and to embrace the quirky and unbalanced world that you create on your own. I think it makes you happier, and also makes you a little bit more focused, because you don’t have to reach this infinity or this perfection that doesn’t really exist in the first place.
然后在某个时候，就在此时–我认为这是我一生中最快乐的时刻–是我完全放弃完美的时候。 我认为，做到不完美，拥抱自己创造的古怪而又不平衡的世界，显得尤为重要。 我认为它使您更快乐，也使您更加专注，因为您不必达到无穷无尽或一开始就不存在的完美。
Maybe I’m just and egoist — it’s all for me, it’s all about me — kind of leaving a trace behind, leaving a step behind, or leaving something meaningful behind. I find that’s really, really important. This also makes me happy, to be honest.
也许我是公正而利己的–对我来说，这一切都是关于我的–留下痕迹，留下一步或留下一些有意义的东西。 我发现这真的非常重要。 老实说，这也让我高兴。
What we decided to do is literally move away from inspirational articles — because pretty much everyone was doing it anyway — towards something that would be more profound, which means that it would describe the process, for example, to describe the tooling, it would also describe the way people are organized when they work.
实际上，我们决定要做的是从鼓舞人心的文章(因为几乎每个人都在这样做)转向更有意义的事情，这意味着它将描述过程，例如描述工具，也将描述人们工作时的组织方式。
I like movies with bad endings, so I’m really looking forward to see how people — I mean, not like I’m looking forward to it but, it’s really interesting for me to see how people failed, and why, because I think that you can even learn more from that than actually from success stories that are all over the place.
我喜欢用坏的结局的电影，所以我真的很期待看到人们如何-我的意思是，没有像我期待的，但，这真的很有趣，我看到人们是如何失败的，为什么呢，因为我觉得您甚至可以从那里学到更多，而不是从遍布各地的成功故事中学到更多。
We did lose traffic, obviously. This has cost us a lot of traffic, but honestly, maybe I’m too naïve about this, but I’ve never been in it for the money. I never wanted to cash out. We had opportunities, but I never felt like I have to do it. It’s like the same thing like people tell me I have to grow the company. I don’t feel like I have to grow the company. I feel very comfortable being small and enjoying my little life happiness/business/writing/something enterprise.
显然，我们确实失去了交通。 这花了我们很多流量，但是老实说，也许我对此太幼稚，但是我从来没有花钱。 我从来不想兑现。 我们有机会，但我从来没有觉得自己必须做。 就像别人告诉我我必须发展公司一样。 我觉得我不必发展公司。 我很小的时候就感到很自在，并享受着我的小生活幸福/生意/写作/某种事业。
you have to find people around you who can actually just double check your article. Just send them over to you and get some feedback. Even if it’s just two people, or just one person. I mean, one person might be biased, but if it’s two people, and they actually give you some feedback that you can build upon, this will improve your article 100%. Not only guaranteed, but also definitely will improve it by 100%, will make it double as good as it was in the beginning.
您必须找到周围的人，他们实际上可以仔细检查您的文章。 只需将它们发送给您并获得一些反馈即可。 即使只有两个人，也可能只有一个人。 我的意思是，一个人可能有偏见，但是如果是两个人，并且他们实际上给了您一些可以建立的反馈，那么这将使您的文章提高100％。 不仅可以保证，而且绝对可以将其提高100％，并使它比起初时翻倍。
I tend to go to Russian-speaking blogs as well, and they have so much good material, it’s incredible. The front-end developers, they are just crazy, it’s literally crazy in a good way. They know so much about everything, and they know every little trick and every little hack and everything is just extreme, it’s unbelievable.
我也经常去讲俄语的博客，它们的资料很多，真是不可思议。 前端开发人员，他们只是疯了，从某种意义上说，这确实是疯了。 他们对所有事情都非常了解，并且他们知道每一个小技巧和每一个小技巧，而且一切都是极端的，这简直令人难以置信。
Hey, what’s up, everybody? This is Tim Evko.
嘿，大家好吗？ 这是蒂姆·埃夫科。
David: 大卫：And this is M. David Green.
这是大卫·格林(M. David Green)。
Tim: 蒂姆：And you’re listening to episode number 11 of the Versioning Podcast.
您正在收听Versioning Podcast的第11集。
David: 大卫：This is a place where we get together to discuss the industry of the web from development to design, with some of the people making it happen today and finding where it’s headed in the next version.
在这里，我们可以聚在一起讨论从开发到设计的Web行业，其中一些人使之成为现实，并找到下一版的发展方向。
Tim: 蒂姆：So let’s go ahead and get this version started.
因此，让我们开始安装该版本。
Today, we have with us Vitaly Friedman, Editor-in-Chief of Smashing Magazine. Thanks to you so much for joining us, Vitaly. How are you doing today?
今天，我们与《粉碎杂志》主编维塔利·弗里德曼(Vitaly Friedman)在一起。 非常感谢您加入我们，Vitaly。 今天过得好吗？
Vitaly: 维塔利：Thank you so much for having me. It’s a pleasure, and I’m really excited to be here today. I’m doing wonderful! What about you guys?
非常感谢您有我。 很高兴，今天很高兴来到这里。 我做的很棒！ 你们呢？
David: 大卫：So far, so good. Vitaly, before we get started with the interview, we usually like to ask our guests a philosophical question. And since this is the Versioning Show, our philosophical question is: in your current career, what version are you, and why?
到目前为止，一切都很好。 十分重要的是，在开始采访之前，我们通常会向客人问一个哲学问题。 既然这是Versioning Show，那么我们的哲学问题是：在您当前的职业中，您是哪个版本，为什么？
Vitaly: 维塔利：OK, that’s a tough one. In my current career … well, I think this is probably my third version, if I should be honest. The reason why I’m saying third is because, when I was growing up, when I was a child, I had a very different perception of the world, and I wouldn’t say it as naïve or so — of course it was — but I really believed that I could just take one day and change everything in the world.
好，那是一个艰难的过程。 坦白地说，在我目前的职业中……我认为这可能是我的第三个版本。 我之所以说第三，是因为，当我长大的时候，当我还是个孩子的时候，我对世界有一种截然不同的看法，我不会说它天真—当然是-但我真的相信我可以花一天时间改变世界上的一切。
At some point I watched this show, which made a very profound influence on me actually, where there was a guy — a little child — with his grandfather, and they were walking, and it was happening in a little village. It was like, I don’t know, maybe there were two, three, four hundred people living there. And he was interviewed, and he said this little thing which literally stuck with me for a while. He said that, Every single day, me and my grandfather, we are traveling around the world, because it’s a circle.
在某个时候，我观看了这个节目，它实际上对我产生了深远的影响，那里有一个男孩-一个孩子-和他的祖父一起，他们走着，这发生在一个小村庄里。 就像，我不知道，也许有两个，三个，四百个人住在那儿。 然后他接受了采访，他说了这个小话，它确实在我身上停留了一段时间。 他说，我和我的祖父每天都环游世界，因为这是一个圆圈。
Basically crossing the entire world in one day. And I thought, Well, maybe this is even possible. I mean, they had a very small village, so they couldn’t go anywhere, so the grandfather invented this story and he would actually invent little worlds around the village so they would walk through once in the North, once in the South, and so on, and they would change direction a little bit. They would kind of make a full circle around the world.
基本上一天就能穿越整个世界。 我想， 也许这甚至有可能。 我的意思是，他们有一个很小的村庄，所以他们什么也去不了，所以祖父发明了这个故事，他实际上会在村庄周围创造出一些小世界，这样他们就可以在北部一次穿过，在南部一次穿过，等等，它们会稍微改变方向。 他们将在全世界范围内转圈。
I believed that at some point, and I felt like I could change the world the same way. Then I grew up, and I started computer science. Then I became one of those people who really believe in science, and in exact things, and in precision, and I was very obsessed with perfection at this point. Everything was literally about perfection, the way my laboratory’s stored, the way my room is decorated, everything was supposed to be precise.
我相信这一点，并且我觉得我可以以同样的方式改变世界。 然后我长大了，并且开始了计算机科学。 然后，我成为那些真正相信科学，精确事物和精确度的人之一，在这一点上，我非常着迷于完美。 一切实际上都是关于完美的东西，实验室的存放方式，房间的装饰方式，一切都应该精确。
Then at some point, right now — and this is like the happiest moment of my life I think — is the point when I gave up on perfection altogether. I think it’s even more important to not be perfect, and to embrace the quirky and unbalanced world that you create on your own. I think it makes you happier, and also makes you a little bit more focused, because you don’t have to reach this infinity or this perfection that doesn’t really exist in the first place.
然后在某个时候，就在此时–我认为这是我一生中最快乐的时刻–是我完全放弃完美的时候。 我认为，做到不完美，拥抱自己创造的古怪而又不平衡的世界，显得尤为重要。 我认为它使您更快乐，也使您更加专注，因为您不必达到无穷无尽或一开始就不存在的完美。
David: 大卫：I love that. It reminds me of the Japanese concept of Wabi-sabi — appreciating the imperfections.
我喜欢那个。 它使我想起了日本的Wabi-sabi概念-欣赏不完美之处。
Vitaly: 维塔利：Right. Right. That’s pretty much it, yes I think so. Although, I wasn’t influenced by that, I think, maybe. I didn’t have many connections with Japanese philosophy back in the day.
对。 对。 就是这样，是的，我想是的。 虽然，也许我不受此影响。 当时，我与日本哲学的联系并不多。
David: 大卫：That’s interesting. Where did you grow up?
那很有意思。 你在哪儿长大的？
Vitaly: 维塔利：I grew up in Minsk, Belarus, in Eastern Europe — which, up until 2000, is where I used to live. It’s not actually far away from where I am right now. Right now I’m in Lithuania, in Vilnius. As I was growing up, it was kind of a nice little story for me, because every single time, every single day, I experienced something new, and I had these really crazy ideas that I don’t even know why I pursued.
我在东欧明斯克的白俄罗斯明斯克长大，直到2000年，我一直居住在那里。 实际上，我离现在的位置并不远。 现在我在维尔纽斯的立陶宛。 在我成长的过程中，这对我来说是个不错的小故事，因为每一次，每一天，我都会经历新的事物，而且我有这些非常疯狂的想法，我什至都不知道为什么要追求。
For example — and it was kind of clever, I think [chuckles] — I had this idea in my mind that there is no proper schedule in the world, so I would watch TV shows like Euronews and BBC and whatever, and I would record the timing when a specific program would be aired, and I would write it down, and then I would make a list of all the schedules — which I thought is perfect, and nobody has it in the world. I don’t even know why I would do that, but this is kind of tasks I invented for myself back in the day.
例如-我觉得这很聪明- (小笑) -我的想法是，世界上没有适当的时间表，所以我会看诸如Euronews和BBC之类的电视节目，然后录制播出特定节目的时间，然后写下来，然后列出所有时间表，我认为这是完美的，世界上没人能做到。 我什至不知道为什么要这么做，但这是我自己当初发明的任务。
David [4:18]: 大卫[4:18] ：You were doing data science right from the start!
您从一开始就在进行数据科学！
Vitaly: 维塔利：I think so. Well, I was really small at this point. I have no idea why I did it. And, actually, it’s kind of nice, because my father, the physicist — sorry, that was growing up — didn’t have proper TV or so at home. It was like a few channels, but they were quite boring. He managed to put on a satellite dish which grabbed the signal, probably illegally, from a hotel nearby, and so we were able to watch all kinds of TV shows, and all kinds of channels like Italian ones and Polish ones.
我认同。 好吧，我当时真的很小。 我不知道为什么要这么做。 而且，实际上，这还不错，因为我的父亲，物理学家-抱歉，那是长大的-家里没有合适的电视机。 就像是几个频道，但它们很无聊。 他设法戴上了一个卫星天线，该天线可能是从附近的一家旅馆中非法获取信号的，因此我们能够观看各种电视节目，以及各种频道，例如意大利和波兰。
I would watch them all the time, so I watched Knight Rider, and Friends, and everything in Polish, which is why I actually understand Polish now. I don’t speak Polish, but I understood it. This is kind of the world I was growing up with; it was crazy in a pretty cool way.
我会一直看他们，所以我看了Knight Rider，Friends和所有波兰语，这就是为什么我现在真正了解波兰语。 我不会说波兰语，但我能理解。 这是我成长的世界； 它以一种非常酷的方式疯狂。
David: 大卫：That’s awesome. I have to tell you, you’re one of the few people we’ve had on the show who actually has a computer science degree.
棒极了。 我必须告诉你，您是我们节目中仅有的少数拥有计算机科学学位的人之一。
Vitaly: 维塔利：Yes, that’s correct.
对，那是正确的。
David: 大卫：Yet you’re not working as an engineer per se, right?
但是您本身不是在从事工程师工作，对吗？
Vitaly: 维塔利：No, not really. Actually, I think that the computer science degree helped me to see the world a little bit differently. I really enjoyed mathematics, and I was actually better in mathematics than in computer science, which is why I took more courses in mathematics in the end — because it helped me build this kind of logical view of things. I think, or I believe, I’m pretty good at planning, I’m pretty good at seeing things through, kind of putting things together, creating these Lego blocks and assembling things. Not necessarily in terms of physics; I’m horrible at assembling little things in real life, but I’m pretty good in virtual life, I think.
不，不是。 实际上，我认为计算机科学学位使我对世界的看法有所不同。 我真的很喜欢数学，实际上我的数学要比计算机科学的要好，这就是为什么我最终选修了更多的数学课程的原因-因为它帮助我建立了这种逻辑的事物观。 我认为，或者我相信，我很擅长计划，我很擅长观察事物，将事物放在一起，创建这些Lego积木和组装事物。 不一定就物理学而言； 我认为在现实生活中组装小东西太可怕了，但是我认为我在虚拟生活中非常出色。
Yeah, I think that computer science kind of helped me create this kind of understanding of the world; it helped me to be really precise in my work, which what editing is all about. Kind of being precise, concise, getting things to the point. Although I’m not using computer science per se everyday, it helped shape my view of things and also my work.
是的，我认为计算机科学可以帮助我建立起对世界的这种理解； 它使我的工作变得非常精确，这就是编辑的全部内容。 有点精确，简明扼要，能说到重点。 尽管我并不是每天都在使用计算机科学，但它有助于塑造我对事物以及我的工作的看法。
Tim: 蒂姆：So, Vitaly, after you got your computer science degree, how did you sort of start to descend into the path of starting Smashing Magazine? How did that whole thing happen?
因此，Vitaly，在获得计算机科学学位之后，您是如何开始着手开始《 Smashing Magazine》的？ 整个事情是如何发生的？
Vitaly: 维塔利：That’s a good point, but I actually didn’t really transition any way. It kind of crushed on me. At the point when I was starting, I was also freelancing, because I was young and need the money. So I just started doing what I could.
很好，但是我实际上并没有进行任何过渡。 有点压在我身上。 在我刚开始的时候，我还在自由职业，因为我还很年轻，需要钱。 所以我才开始尽我所能。
Basically, back in Belarus back in late ’90s, I was playing a little bit with all kinds of old technologies like VML and Flash (no, it wasn’t Flash, it was Shockwave), and all kind of things like that. I just played with it. Then, when we moved to Germany in the year 2000 (my father brought the entire family with him), I kind of tried to find my way of earning money and also building up things, because I didn’t speak the language, I didn’t have any penny. I didn’t want to get any penny from my parents, so I wanted to do something on my own, and the only thing I knew how to do is how to build pretty crappy Shockwave websites.
基本上，回到90年代后期的白俄罗斯，我在玩各种旧技术，例如VML和Flash(不，它不是Flash，它是Shockwave )，以及诸如此类的东西。 我只是玩过而已。 然后，当我们在2000年移居德国时(我父亲带了整个家庭)，我有点想找到赚钱和积累东西的方法，因为我不会说英语，所以我没有一分钱都没有。 我不想从父母那里得到任何好处，所以我想自己做一些事情，而我唯一知道的方法是如何建立非常糟糕的Shockwave网站。
So I decided to kind of jump into it while I was studying computer science. At the time, I also was freelancing. And there was a night university gig at the time, when I was supposed to maintain one of the websites, and I jumped into it, and this is kind of my opportunity where I learned all about HTML, and CSS, and so on and so forth. It was a really good timing, actually, too, because this was the point when CSS actually became the thing, when you could see all kind of articles appearing on A List Apart about sprites, and images, border radius techniques, and whatever — all kind of things like that.
因此，我在学习计算机科学时决定跳入这一领域。 当时，我也在自由职业。 当时有一个晚上的大学演出，当时我应该维护一个网站，然后我跳进了网站，这是我学习HTML和CSS等所有知识的良机。向前。 实际上，这也是一个非常好的时机，因为这是CSS真正成为现实的时候，您可以看到A列表中出现了有关精灵，图像，边界半径技术以及其他所有内容的所有文章。诸如此类的事情。
David [7:43]: 大卫[7:43]：The expanding shutter for wide buttons, et cetera?
用于宽按钮的扩展百叶窗，等等？
Vitaly: 维塔利：Yes. You know, it’s very surprising, because sometimes I actually get to meet these people who wrote these articles 10 to 15 years ago. It’s a long time ago. Sliding Doors, and all kind of things like that. And I think, wow, this is long time ago. This is when I jumped into web development.
是。 您知道，这非常令人惊讶，因为有时我实际上遇到了10到15年前写这些文章的人。 很久以前了 推拉门，以及类似的东西。 我想，哇，这是很久以前的事了。 这是我跳入Web开发的时间。
Smashing Magazine became kind of a side product, more or less, because I was freelancing, and I was always looking for these techniques, and I remember vividly spending a lot of time at my mom’s kitchen table, at the time, to just understand the CSS box model — understand how all the things work. It took me quite a lot of time, actually. It wasn’t that easy; floating wasn’t easy. It really took me a while to understand why I can float left and right but top and bottom. I just couldn’t get it, it was so weird, it’s like something I couldn’t understand.
Smashing Magazine或多或少地成为一种副产品，因为我一直在自由职业，并且我一直在寻找这些技术，而且我还记得当时我在母亲的厨房餐桌上花了大量的时间只是为了了解CSS盒子模型-了解所有事物的工作方式。 实际上，这花了我很多时间。 并不是那么容易。 浮动并不容易。 我花了一段时间才明白为什么我可以左右浮动，但上下浮动。 我只是听不懂，这太奇怪了，就像我听不懂。
David: 大卫：You and the rest of the web.
您和网络的其余部分。
Vitaly: 维塔利：Yes, I think so. So I started collecting all these techniques that would make my life easier as a freelancer. In the end, it has become this big web-developer’s handbook, which was released at some point. It was on Slashdot and Dig and everything. Then, this was kind of my way of looking into these techniques, and then eventually a colleague of mine from Germany, he suggested to create a magazine in English because he was writing a German magazine at the time — a German-speaking magazine. I said, Well, why not? So, I was blogging at the time, so I just translated some of the articles that I wrote for him, for his magazine, into English, and this is how it all started — what in the end was just a collection of techniques that I could use for my work. I was selfish, and a bastard — you know how it is — thinking only about myself, that’s it … and wanted to share with the community, too.
是的，我想是这样。 因此，我开始收集所有这些技巧，这将使我作为自由职业者的生活更加轻松。 最终，它成为了这个大的Web开发人员的手册 ，并在某个时候发行了。 它在Slashdot和Dig等所有内容上。 然后，这是我研究这些技术的一种方式，后来成为我的一位来自德国的同事，他建议用英语创建一本杂志，因为他当时正在写一本德国杂志-会说德语。 我说， 嗯，为什么不呢？ 因此，我当时在写博客，所以我只是将为他写的一些文章(为他的杂志)翻译成英文，这就是一切的开始-最终只是我收集的一些技术可以用于我的工作。 我很自私，是个混蛋-您知道这是怎么回事-只在想自己，就是这样...并且也想与社区分享。
David: 大卫：I think that that last bit is really the key point — wanting to share with the community. You weren’t the only person out there publishing information like that, but Smashing Magazine has developed an amazing reputation for delivering really in-depth, high-quality content. I’m curious how you made the transition from being one of the people out there publishing content about this, to being such a premier publication.
我认为最后一点确实是关键点-希望与社区分享。 您并不是唯一发布此类信息的人，但是Smashing Magazine在提供真正深入，高质量的内容方面已享有惊人的声誉。 我很好奇您是如何从成为发布有关此内容的人之一过渡到成为如此出色的出版物的。
Vitaly: 维塔利：That’s a very good point. I look back, and I realize it was actually September 2006, pretty much 10 years ago, when it all started. It all started with a quick and cheap blog posts, like 40 free amazing wallpapers, or 40 free, beautiful, yellow websites, and things like that. Which I just, at this point, was just inspirational, and we had all kinds of photography — black and white photography and everything.
这是非常好的一点。 我回头看，我意识到实际上是大约10年前的2006年9月，这一切都开始了。 一切始于快速而廉价的博客文章，例如40个免费的精美壁纸或40个免费的美丽黄色网站等。 在这一点上，我只是鼓舞人心的，我们有各种各样的摄影作品-黑白摄影等等。
So it was all about just publishing something that we believed was good, but was also quite quick to do. But at the same time, of course, the main priority and the main focus was development, web development, web design — so CSS, JavaScript, jQuery and everything related was kind of a big deal. However, what we noticed quite quickly is that, at some point, at least personally, I had a problem, because I couldn’t identify myself with the work that we were doing.
因此，这仅仅是发布我们认为不错的东西，但也很快。 但同时，当然，同时，主要优先事项和主要重点是开发，Web开发，Web设计-因此CSS，JavaScript，jQuery和所有相关的东西都很大。 但是，我们很快注意到的是，在某个时候，至少在个人方面，我遇到了问题，因为我无法从我们所做的工作中认出自己。
We saw of course that traffic is coming in if we publish things like 50 amazing wallpapers that will make you cry, stuff like that. We see that people actually come to the site, traffic increases, and we had advertising running, so obviously it helps. But I didn’t really feel that I could connect with this, and didn’t feel that I wanted my name to stand behind it. That was kind of a crucial point. At some point, having a proper editorial workflow, editorial guidelines, editorial work, where an article would stand for itself was really really important. Actually we were doing that at the time anyway; it was just a little bit different, because it was more about just collecting resources and presenting them.
我们当然看到，如果发布50种令人惊叹的壁纸之类的东西会让您流泪 ，那么流量就会增加 。 我们看到人们实际上来到了该网站，访问量增加了，并且我们投放了广告，因此显然可以帮上忙。 但是我真的不觉得自己可以与之联系，也不想让自己的名字站出来。 这很关键。 在某个时候，拥有适当的编辑工作流程，编辑指南，编辑工作，使文章能够代表自己确实很重要。 实际上，无论如何我们当时都在这样做。 只是有点不同，因为它更多的是关于收集资源并进行展示。
I did want to kind of push into more in-depth material, which would actually stay relevant over the course of time. I wanted actually, deliberately, to move away from these wallpapers, towards becoming a professional respected magazine, because at the time I didn’t feel like it was respected at all. People were coming from all over the world to download wallpapers and icons and looking for inspiration, maybe, but I didn’t feel that Smashing Magazine was standing for a respected publication. It was more like a blog, list blog, maybe, and I didn’t feel comfortable with it.
我确实想推动更深入的材料，实际上这些材料将随着时间的流逝而保持相关性。 我实际上是故意地从这些墙纸转移到成为专业的受人尊敬的杂志，因为当时我一点也不觉得它受到尊重。 也许来自世界各地的人们下载墙纸和图标并寻找灵感，但我并不认为Smashing Magazine代表着受人尊敬的出版物。 也许它更像是博客，列表博客，但我对此并不满意。
So we changed, basically almost over night. We decided to move the direction away from the lists to serious content, and we established all kinds of things, like an editorial panel, an experts panel, which would actually review articles before they get published. So of course, costs increased as well, and traffic dropped significantly. That’s important, because we lost a lot of traffic because of this transition, but what I feel is important, we gained a lot of trust and we also gained a lot of good traffic from people who are designers and developers who trust us, and who just want to invest into buying our products, or supporting us in any way possible, because they know that there are people who really care about the work that they’re doing. This is kind of really important for me, because I feel that the work I’m doing today really matters because there are people out there who find it useful.
所以我们改变了，基本上是整夜。 我们决定将方向从清单转移到严肃的内容，并建立了各种事物，例如编辑小组，专家小组，这些小组实际上会在文章发表之前对其进行审查。 因此，当然，成本也会增加，流量也会大大减少。 这很重要，因为由于此过渡我们损失了很多流量，但是我觉得很重要，我们赢得了很多信任，并且从信任我们的设计师和开发人员以及那些获得我们信任的人那里获得了很多良好的流量只是想投资购买我们的产品，或以任何可能的方式为我们提供支持，因为他们知道有些人真的很在乎他们所做的工作。 这对我来说真的很重要，因为我觉得我今天所做的工作确实很重要，因为那里有人认为它有用。
Which is why, just today, actually, I finished this crazy article which took me almost four to five months to prepare, which is pretty much like I think nine or ten thousand words. It took a lot of research, and a lot of interviews, and everything. But I did want to write it, because I think that people will appreciate it. People will like it, will find it useful, they will find it valuable — and maybe even, at some point, it will be one of those articles that become kind of important for people, that they will look back to and think, Oh, yeah, that article.
这就是为什么实际上直到今天我才完成了这篇疯狂的文章，我花了将近四到五个月的时间来准备，这几乎就像我认为的九，一万个单词。 它进行了大量的研究，大量的采访以及所有内容。 但是我确实想写它，因为我认为人们会感激它。 人们会喜欢它，会发现它有用，他们会发现它很有价值-甚至在某个时候，这将成为对人们来说很重要的那些文章之一，让他们回顾并思考， 哦，是的，那篇文章。
Maybe I’m just and egoist — it’s all for me, it’s all about me — kind of leaving a trace behind, leaving a step behind, or leaving something meaningful behind. I find that’s really, really important. This also makes me happy, to be honest.
也许我是公正而利己的–对我来说，这一切都是关于我的–留下痕迹，留下一步或留下一些有意义的东西。 我发现这真的非常重要。 老实说，这也让我高兴。
Tim [13:35]: 蒂姆[13:35]：My question is, when you made this transition from your lists-style content or resources for other developers to really in-depth, intense and passionate articles, how did you go about choosing the content that you would publish for this — almost at that point in time — new version of your site?
我的问题是，当您从列表样式的内容或其他开发人员的资源过渡到真正深入，紧张而充满激情的文章时，您几乎是如何选择要为此发布的内容的？及时-您网站的新版本？
Vitaly: 维塔利：That’s a very interesting point. What we decided to do is literally move away from inspirational articles — because pretty much everyone was doing it anyway — towards something that would be more profound, which means that it would describe the process, for example, to describe the tooling, it would also describe the way people are organized when they work.
这是非常有趣的一点。 实际上，我们决定要做的是从鼓舞人心的文章(因为几乎每个人都在这样做)转向更有意义的事情，这意味着它将描述过程，例如描述工具，也将描述人们工作时的组织方式。
So, for example, we started looking a bit more into case studies. For example, somebody might have built a project, might have built a website, so what exactly was the process behind? What did people building or designing it learn along the way? What were the mistakes they were running into all the time?
因此，例如，我们开始更多地研究案例研究。 例如，某人可能已经建立了一个项目，可能已经建立了一个网站，那么背后的过程到底是什么？ 人们在构建或设计它的过程中学到了什么？ 他们一直遇到的错误是什么？
I think that actually, what I tried to focus on a lot over these last five/six years is not necessarily those big success stories, which you can hear in BuzzFeed and Fast Company and so on, or TechCrunch. Everybody likes success stories, because they are manifestations or manifests of people succeeding because of hard work. It’s like a movie. Everybody likes a good movie with a good ending. But I like movies with bad endings, so I’m really looking forward to see how people — I mean, not like I’m looking forward to it but, it’s really interesting for me to see how people failed, and why, because I think that you can even learn more from that than actually from success stories that are all over the place.
我认为，实际上，在过去的五六年中，我试图重点关注的不一定是那些巨大的成功案例，您可以在BuzzFeed和Fast Company等公司(或TechCrunch)中听到这些成功案例。 每个人都喜欢成功的故事，因为它们是人们努力工作的成功的体现或表现。 就像电影一样。 每个人都喜欢一部结局不错的电影。 但我喜欢坏的结局的电影，所以我真的很期待看到人们如何-我的意思是，没有像我期待的，但，这真的很有趣，我看到人们是如何失败的，为什么呢，因为我认为您甚至可以从中学到更多成功案例，从中学到更多。
Maybe these people actually have recovered from their failures and succeeded then later, because every success has a couple of failures along the way, which is why we kind of started looking to things that went wrong in projects. What are the pain points the designers and developers and maybe project managers or whoever was involved had along the way? What did they start with, and what did they finish with in the end? Maybe the finish line was not as they expected at all.
也许这些人实际上已经从失败中恢复过来，后来又成功了，因为每一次成功都伴随着几次失败，这就是为什么我们开始着眼于项目中出现问题的原因。 设计师和开发人员以及项目经理或参与其中的任何人在此过程中会遇到什么痛苦？ 他们从什么开始，到最后他们完成了什么？ 终点线可能根本不像他们预期的那样。
We started looking to this particular aspect of articles in more depth. More specifically, so you build something, you’re not writer, that’s okay, we don’t expect you to have excellent writing skills, because we have editors and proof readers and everybody who can help you. What we want to know is what you learned as you were building or designing this thing, because I think that many people can actually learn something from that too.
我们开始更深入地研究文章的这一特定方面。 更具体地说，您构建的东西不是作家，那没关系，我们不希望您拥有出色的写作技巧，因为我们拥有编辑和校对读者，并且每个人都可以为您提供帮助。 我们想知道的是您在构建或设计此东西时学到的东西，因为我认为许多人也可以从中学到一些东西。
David [16:00]: 大卫[16:00]：When you were developing Smashing Magazine and you went through this transition, did you yourself view that as failure, or did you see that as something else?
当您开发Smashing Magazine时，经历了这种过渡时，您是否自己将其视为失败，还是将其视为其他事情？
Vitaly: 维塔利：To be honest, I never felt like it’s a failure. I mean, I did some mistakes along the way, when we had a few kind of strange articles, so to say, which I really stood behind — which I felt right, which should be published — and the feedback was just horrible from all parts of the community. This is my mistake, probably, that I kind of trusted myself too much at this point, and pushed the envelope seal — although there were people around me telling me not to do it.
老实说，我从来没有觉得这是一个失败。 我的意思是，当我们有几篇奇怪的文章时，我就犯了一些错误，可以这么说，我确实站在后面-我认为是正确的，应该发表-而且各个方面的反馈都令人震惊社区。 这可能是我的错误，尽管此时我有点过分信任自己，并推了信封盖-尽管我周围有人告诉我不要这样做。
But I don’t feel that we made some crucial mistakes. We love experimentation, we love kind of trying things out. So we do things when we feel like it should be done. And then, if it’s wrong, then we will just correct ourselves. We will never, for example, delete something, delete an article or delete a tweet or delete a message or stuff like that, or say thing that we didn’t mean it that way although we actually meant it. I think you can always recover by being honest and transparent about what your true motivation is, because people will respect that; they will appreciate that you are being straight with them.
但是我不认为我们犯了一些关键性的错误。 我们热爱实验，热爱尝试事物。 因此，当我们觉得应该做的时候就去做。 然后，如果这是错误的，那么我们将纠正自己。 例如，我们绝不会删除某些东西，删除某篇文章或删除一条推文，删除某条消息或类似的东西，或者说虽然我们实际上是故意的，但并不是那样说。 我认为您始终可以对自己的真实动机保持诚实和透明，因为人们会尊重这一点； 他们将欣赏您与他们同在。
So, I don’t think that this is mistake. We did lose traffic, obviously. This has cost us a lot of traffic, but honestly, maybe I’m too naïve about this, but I’ve never been in it for the money. I never wanted to cash out. We had opportunities, but I never felt like I have to do it. It’s like the same thing like people tell me I have to grow the company. I don’t feel like I have to grow the company. I feel very comfortable being small and enjoying my little life happiness/business/writing/something enterprise. We have at this point 11 people in the team, and many editors around the world, of course, who are working part time, mostly, and they’re just amazing. That’s OK; that makes me happy.
所以，我不认为这是错误的。 显然，我们确实失去了交通。 这花了我们很多流量，但是老实说，也许我对此太幼稚，但是我从来没有花钱。 我从来不想兑现。 我们有机会，但我从来没有觉得自己必须做。 就像别人告诉我我必须发展公司一样。 我觉得我不必发展公司。 我很小的时候就感到很自在，并享受着我的小生活幸福/生意/写作/某种事业。 到目前为止，我们团队中有11名成员，当然还有世界各地的许多编辑，大部分时间都是兼职，他们真是太了不起了。 没关系; 这让我高兴。
David: 大卫：I think there are a lot of us out here who are hoping that you don’t decide to sell out, because keeping it the way that it is is very useful for everybody who’s reading the magazine.
我认为我们当中有很多人希望您不决定卖光，因为按照这种方式保存对每个阅读该杂志的人都非常有用。
Vitaly: 维塔利：Yes. But of course, you could say there are many things we could do, but actually for me what was really important — always has been important — is to stay independent. I never want to be one of the — OK, maybe it will sound a bit harsh — but one of the people behind a big fancy brand that owns a thousand magazines out there. I would never want that. It’s kind of really cool, I think, it’s really nice still even ten years later now, to be able to know that if I feel like it I can just write down something in WordPress (that we’re using still, 10 years later), and hit the publish button, and it will be published. I don’t have to ask anybody, I don’t have to ask for permission. That’s amazing. I feel like even just knowing that I could do that (although I probably wouldn’t do that, because we have editors, and we have all kinds of editorial reviews and so on), but knowing that I could do that gives me a huge boost in motivation.
是。 但是，当然，您可以说我们可以做很多事情，但是对我来说，真正重要的是-始终如此重要-保持独立。 我从不想成为其中的一员-好吧，也许听起来有些刺耳-但其中一个拥有100多种杂志的高档品牌背后的人之一。 我永远不会想要那个。 我觉得这真的很酷，即使十年后仍然很不错，我可以知道，如果我愿意，我可以用WordPress写下一些东西(十年后我们仍在使用) ，然后点击发布按钮，它将被发布。 我不必问任何人，也不必征求许可。 棒极了。 我觉得我什至只是知道我可以做到(尽管我可能不会那样做，因为我们有编辑，我们有各种各样的社论评论等等)，但是知道我可以做到的事给了我很大的收获。激发动力。
David: 大卫：I can imagine, and you say you’re still using WordPress as your back end. I was going to ask you some more about how Smashing Magazine runs technically.
我可以想象，您说您仍在使用WordPress作为后端。 我想问您更多有关《粉碎杂志》在技术上如何运行的信息。
Vitaly: 维塔利：Yeah. It’s actually not a very complicated setup. We are running WordPress, we use nginx, we do use MaxCDN, we are hosted on Media Temple (Media Temple has been very supportive for us I must admit at this point). Yeah, still, everything is quite simple, we’re running PHP, LAMP, EasyStack, so nothing too revolutionary at this point, I’m afraid.
是的 实际上这不是一个非常复杂的设置。 我们运行的是WordPress，我们使用的是nginx，我们使用的是MaxCDN，我们托管在Media Temple上(我必须承认Media Temple对我们非常支持)。 是的，一切仍然非常简单，我们正在运行PHP，LAMP， EasyStack ，因此恐怕在这一点上没有什么革命性的事情。
Tim: 蒂姆：You mentioned that you employ this philosophy of non-precision, but at the same time, Smashing Magazine I feel is a very precise technical, high-standard publication. So how do you seem to balance those two sort of philosophies and behaviors? Then my second part would be, do you have any advice for web developers who are looking to produce that same level of precision and technical excellence that we see from Smashing Magazine?
您提到您采用了这种非精确的哲学，但是与此同时，我认为《粉碎杂志》是一种非常精确的技术，高标准的出版物。 那么，您似乎如何在这两种哲学和行为之间取得平衡？ 然后，我的第二部分是，您对寻求达到Smashing Magazine所见水平的精确度和技术卓越水平的Web开发人员有何建议？
Vitaly [19:46]: 维塔利[19:46]：All right. That’s a very interesting question. I think at this point it’s important that an article that gets published on the site is right. It cannot have any mistakes in terms of code, because we cannot afford propagating bad practices. This is just not acceptable.
行。 这是一个非常有趣的问题。 我认为在这一点上，在网站上发表的文章正确是很重要的。 它在代码方面不会有任何错误，因为我们无法承担传播不良做法的风险。 这是不可接受的。
The same way we cannot afford having anything that might be biased. So we don’t have product placement. We do have sponsored content, but it’s marked as such. The articles that are published, if they’re coming from us, coming from our authors, they cannot be biased, which is why we do not accept authors who are working on a specific product and want to write about that product. This is just not going to work.
以同样的方式，我们不能承受任何可能有偏见的事情。 因此，我们没有产品展示位置。 我们确实有赞助内容，但已将其标记为此类内容。 发表的文章，如果它们来自我们，来自我们的作者，则不能带有偏见，这就是为什么我们不接受正在开发特定产品并想写该产品的作者的原因。 这只是行不通的。
We also have editorial guidelines and a publishing policy which really clearly state the things that we do and the things that we don’t do. Obviously not every author reads them, but for us they’re really guiding. They help us decide whether we choose a certain direction in terms of an article or not. It helps us decide whether we accept a certain article or certain author or not as well. This is kind of really the thing. I don’t think it’s perfect. I don’t think that it kind of drives us towards perfection, towards these perfect articles that you can’t even touch, where it’s all just marvelous and shiny and everything. I think what we tend to do in order to avoid perfect then is to kind of try to bring in the personal note. So people just write about their experiences, and they can’t be perfect, and they can’t be imperfect either: they’re just their own experiences.
我们还具有编辑指南和发布政策 ，这些政策确实清楚地说明了我们所做的事情和我们未做的事情。 显然，并不是每个作者都阅读它们，但是对我们来说，它们确实是指导。 它们可以帮助我们决定是否根据文章选择某个方向。 它可以帮助我们决定是否接受某些文章或作者。 这是真的。 我认为这并不完美。 我不认为这会驱使我们走向完美，走向您甚至都无法触及的完美文章，这些文章都是奇妙而闪亮的。 我认为，为了避免那么的完美，我们倾向于做的是尝试引入个人笔记。 因此，人们只是写自己的经历，他们不能完美，也不能完美：它们只是他们自己的经历。
When they write about them, some things maybe — as it is in normal, in regular life — sometimes you’re supposed to, you know, logically you would do this because it makes sense, but maybe you will not do this because you have business requirements, or something comes in, and stuff like that. So it’s like a story. And stories don’t have to be perfect. The same way, I feel like maybe sometimes our authors are trying way too hard to write this perfect paragraph or write this perfect sentence, and I encourage them to actually make mistakes. I encourage them to put a wrong comma in a place, or just don’t think about it too much, just write down the things that really bother you that you think are important. We will take care of the commas, and if we missed the comma, that’s OK too; that’s not a big deal. I mean, nobody is going to die if we have a wrong semicolon in the wrong place.
当他们写关于他们的文章时，也许有些事情-在正常的生活中，在正常的生活中-有时候，您应该知道，从逻辑上讲，您会这样做是因为这样做有意义，但也许您不会这样做，因为您拥有业务需求或诸如此类的东西。 所以这就像一个故事。 故事并不一定是完美的。 同样，我觉得有时候我们的作者可能会太努力地写这个完美的段落或写这个完美的句子，我鼓励他们实际犯错。 我鼓励他们在一个地方放置一个错误的逗号，或者只是不要考虑太多，只写下那些您认为很重要的事情，这些事情确实会打扰您。 我们将处理逗号，如果我们错过了逗号，那也没关系； 没什么大不了的。 我的意思是，如果我们在错误的地方放错了分号，那么谁也不会死。
David: 大卫：I think a lot of us who might be out here looking at Smashing Magazine from the outside, we see this beautiful, perfected thing that gets published, and it’s intimidating, and I can understand why an author would want to really polish, get every detail, before submitting something to you.
我想我们当中很多人可能会从外面看着Smashing Magazine，我们看到这本精美，完美的书被出版了，而且令人生畏，而且我能理解为什么作者想要真正修饰并获得每一个细节，然后再向您提交内容。
Vitaly: 维塔利：The thing is, the truth is that I actually just published an article like a month ago about the process that poor authors have to run through (Behind The Scenes: What It Takes To Publish A Smashing Article), and they are intimidated at times, and sometimes they are literally crushed. I’m getting email sometimes from people who are not crying, but they are disappointed — literally disappointed — because they invest so much time and they feel like we’re putting them through hell. And I’m proud of it, to be honest. OK, it’s not like I’m liking it, but it’s my job to publish good articles, so I really feel that it’s my obligation in a way to push the author to the edge. It doesn’t mean that I have to pull them over the edge, but I have to push them to the edge to question everything, and sometimes I feel like I’m playing devil’s advocate all the time.
事实是，我实际上实际上像一个月前就发表了一篇文章，讲述贫穷的作者必须经历的过程( 幕后花絮：发表砸碎文章所需要的内容 )，并且有时会被吓到，有时它们实际上被压碎了。 我有时会收到不哭的人的电子邮件，但他们很失望-真的很失望-因为他们投入了太多时间，并且觉得我们正在使他们陷入困境。 老实说，我为此感到自豪。 好的，这不是我喜欢的，但是发表好文章是我的工作，所以我真的觉得，这是我有义务将作者推向最前沿。 这并不意味着我必须将它们拖在边缘，而是必须将它们推到边缘以质疑所有问题，有时我觉得我一直在扮演魔鬼的拥护者。
Like, I know that I would agree with that statement that the author just wrote, I fully agree with that, and I’m pretty sure that most developers out there would. But I have to question its validity. Why is it like that? Do you have any data? Does it come from your experience? Can you prove that? Maybe this is totally wrong. I’m always trying to kind of push a little bit harder, and at some point I push maybe too hard. But that’s OK. I’m not here to be liked. What really was important for us, and probably crucial for Smashing Magazine to evolve towards a publication — well-respected publication — was to introduce the experts panel.
就像，我知道我会同意作者刚才写的那句话，我完全同意这一点，而且我很确定大多数开发者都会同意。 但我不得不质疑其有效性。 为什么会这样呢？ 你有资料吗 它是否来自您的经验？ 你能证明吗？ 也许这是完全错误的。 我一直都在努力地加大力度，有时我可能会努力地加大力度。 但是没关系。 我不是在这里被喜欢。 对我们来说真正重要的，也许对Smashing Magazine朝着出版物(备受尊敬的出版物)发展至关重要的是引入专家小组 。
The experts panel for us is kind of a panel of 110 people (maybe 120 at this point) from our industry — all people who have been around for a while, from very different areas, be it front end, be it back end, be it search engine optimization, be it Photoshop, or visual design, pattern libraries libraries, whatever. All kinds of different areas.
我们的专家小组由来自行业的110名成员组成(目前可能是120名)–所有在不同领域从事过一段时间的人，无论是前端，后端还是搜索引擎优化(无论是Photoshop还是视觉设计)，模式库库等。 各种不同的领域。
What we do is, before that article gets published, we always run it through this panel. So we need two reviews at least, and these people who are submitting feedback, they have to also rate an article. And an article gets published if it gets a certain average rating. It has to be about 3.6 or 3.7 (I think we increased the threshold at this point).
我们要做的是，在该文章发表之前，我们总是通过此面板运行它。 因此，我们至少需要两次审阅，而这些正在提交反馈的人也必须对文章进行评分。 如果一篇文章获得一定的平均评分，它就会被发表。 它必须约为3.6或3.7(我认为我们此时已提高了阈值)。
So, why is it helpful for developers out there? Well, because I feel, well obviously it helped at first because we tried to publish good articles. But I mean, for people out there, I think that my advice would be to say, you have to find people around you who can actually just double check your article. Just send them over to you and get some feedback. Even if it’s just two people, or just one person. I mean, one person might be biased, but if it’s two people, and they actually give you some feedback that you can build upon, this will improve your article 100%. Not only guaranteed, but also definitely will improve it by 100%, will make it double as good as it was in the beginning.
那么，为什么对那里的开发人员有帮助呢？ 好吧，因为我感觉很明显，起初它很有帮助，因为我们试图发布出色的文章。 但是我的意思是，对于外面的人，我认为我的建议是说，您必须找到周围的人，他们实际上可以仔细检查您的文章。 只需将它们发送给您并获得一些反馈即可。 即使只有两个人，也可能只有一个人。 我的意思是，一个人可能有偏见，但是如果是两个人，并且他们实际上给了您一些可以建立的反馈，那么这将使您的文章提高100％。 不仅可以保证，而且绝对可以将其提高100％，并使它比起初时翻倍。
If you could get some feedback, just from people in the industry. I think that many people out there are really nice people in our industry. We are privileged to be working with these kinds of people. If you can just send the article to a person you admire, and they spend 20 minutes reading it, and maybe giving you a few notes of what are the things that are wrong or right, that will give you a direction to go to. As a result, you will end up with a better article, I’m sure. We do encourage everybody to write, so every time I find a weird, interesting, crazy, strange project, I do send an email, or we do send emails to authors kind of encouraging them to write.
如果您可以从业内人士那里得到一些反馈。 我认为很多人在我们的行业中都是非常好的人。 我们很荣幸与这些人一起工作。 If you can just send the article to a person you admire, and they spend 20 minutes reading it, and maybe giving you a few notes of what are the things that are wrong or right, that will give you a direction to go to. As a result, you will end up with a better article, I'm sure. We do encourage everybody to write, so every time I find a weird, interesting, crazy, strange project, I do send an email, or we do send emails to authors kind of encouraging them to write.
Also, because I speak Russian as well, because of my background, I tend to go to Russian-speaking blogs as well, and they have so much good material, it’s incredible. The front-end developers, they are just crazy, it’s literally crazy in a good way. They know so much about everything, and they know every little trick and every little hack and everything is just extreme, it’s unbelievable. I kind of try to encourage them to write more as well, and as a result we do have some really interesting and unique articles published in Smashing as well, because there are some closed areas.
Also, because I speak Russian as well, because of my background, I tend to go to Russian-speaking blogs as well, and they have so much good material, it's incredible. The front-end developers, they are just crazy, it's literally crazy in a good way. They know so much about everything, and they know every little trick and every little hack and everything is just extreme, it's unbelievable. I kind of try to encourage them to write more as well, and as a result we do have some really interesting and unique articles published in Smashing as well, because there are some closed areas.
Very much like — this is what I experienced — the Chinese area; the Chinese front-end community is quite closed. There are many people writing about the front end in China, but it will be written in Mandarin in Chinese, so we don’t see that at all. Same happens in Russian-speaking communities: often you will find really brilliant articles written in Russian, but not translated through English, so they kind of stay stuck in this community. I feel that it happens to some degree in France as well, but I don’t speak French so I can’t really … I don’t speak Chinese either, but that’s a different story.
Very much like — this is what I experienced — the Chinese area; the Chinese front-end community is quite closed. There are many people writing about the front end in China, but it will be written in Mandarin in Chinese, so we don't see that at all. Same happens in Russian-speaking communities: often you will find really brilliant articles written in Russian, but not translated through English, so they kind of stay stuck in this community. I feel that it happens to some degree in France as well, but I don't speak French so I can't really … I don't speak Chinese either, but that's a different story.
[Background chuckling]
[Background chuckling]
I just happen to have a few people in China who tell me about these articles. And I still feel like we have this language barrier, which is a bit of a shame, but this is where unique perspectives come from. So I’m always trying to find these people working on these weird unusual projects and pull them in somehow to write. So anybody can write an article for Smashing, and everybody is invited to write an article as well. It will take some time, and it will be hard work, but if you are willing to accept it and invest your time in it, we will get to good results.
I just happen to have a few people in China who tell me about these articles. And I still feel like we have this language barrier, which is a bit of a shame, but this is where unique perspectives come from. So I'm always trying to find these people working on these weird unusual projects and pull them in somehow to write. So anybody can write an article for Smashing, and everybody is invited to write an article as well. It will take some time, and it will be hard work, but if you are willing to accept it and invest your time in it, we will get to good results.
David [27:18]: David [27:18]:Fantastic. So, how can our listeners find you online?
太棒了 So, how can our listeners find you online?
Vitaly: Vitaly:That’s not very difficult, I think. Not many people know that, but most tweets that are coming from our Smashing Mag account are from me, and I’m trying my best actually to make sure that this account is not seen as a corporate account, but as a personal account. You can just tweet me; I’m replying all the time, that’s not that hard.
That's not very difficult, I think. Not many people know that, but most tweets that are coming from our Smashing Mag account are from me, and I'm trying my best actually to make sure that this account is not seen as a corporate account, but as a personal account. You can just tweet me; I'm replying all the time, that's not that hard.
Also the same story on Facebook: our Facebook group is also the same story. Obviously it’s the Smashing Mag account, but it’s kind of my personal account in a way. It’s like in organized conferences: sometimes I feel like I’m inviting people to my private second birthday party to hang out with cool people.
Also the same story on Facebook: our Facebook group is also the same story. Obviously it's the Smashing Mag account, but it's kind of my personal account in a way. It's like in organized conferences: sometimes I feel like I'm inviting people to my private second birthday party to hang out with cool people.
David: 大卫：That’s awesome. I love the way that you’ve put that all together. I really appreciate you taking the time to come talk with us today.
棒极了。 I love the way that you've put that all together. I really appreciate you taking the time to come talk with us today.
Vitaly: Vitaly:It’s been my pleasure. Thank you so much! I hope I didn’t speak too much.
It's been my pleasure. 非常感谢！ I hope I didn't speak too much.
Tim: 蒂姆：Not at all; this has been delightful.
Not at all; this has been delightful.
Vitaly: Vitaly:Excellent, thank you so much for having me.
Excellent, thank you so much for having me.
Wow, I feel like we could have a book of just questions and answers from Vitaly. He has just a wealth of information, and so much to share.
Wow, I feel like we could have a book of just questions and answers from Vitaly. He has just a wealth of information, and so much to share.
David: 大卫：I love the perspective he brings to this. It’s like he’s designed a life for himself around trying to share knowledge and information. And in the process, he’s tapped in to such a rich vein of valuable content, it’s amazing.
I love the perspective he brings to this. It's like he's designed a life for himself around trying to share knowledge and information. And in the process, he's tapped in to such a rich vein of valuable content, it's amazing.
Tim: 蒂姆：Yeah. It was very interesting, because I would almost expect his personality to be very precise and on point because of the way that Smashing Magazine feels from a reader’s perspective. Vitaly seems a lot more curious and just ready to have fun with the whole process. It’s very cool to see that someone with that outlook can successfully put forward such incredibly well-structured and well-thought-out content.
是的 It was very interesting, because I would almost expect his personality to be very precise and on point because of the way that Smashing Magazine feels from a reader's perspective. Vitaly seems a lot more curious and just ready to have fun with the whole process. It's very cool to see that someone with that outlook can successfully put forward such incredibly well-structured and well-thought-out content.
David: 大卫：The depth of the content that goes there is always the thing that amazes me, because you can go to a Smashing Magazine article and you know that you could be there for hours exploring the sub links, exploring all of the details. So much comes out of each one of those pieces. I can just imagine: he said it can take months for a single one to come together, and it absolutely shows in the product.
The depth of the content that goes there is always the thing that amazes me, because you can go to a Smashing Magazine article and you know that you could be there for hours exploring the sub links, exploring all of the details. So much comes out of each one of those pieces. I can just imagine: he said it can take months for a single one to come together, and it absolutely shows in the product.
Tim: 蒂姆：I didn’t mention this, but I’ve written three articles for Smashing Magazine, two of which had been published. One was rejected, and I spent quite a bit of time working on the rejected one. It was for accessibility, and I wanted to just write about introduction stuff — like if you are working on a site or an application, here’s the stuff that you do. The editor was very nice and offered suggestions; I worked on a second draft, and he came back and said, Sorry, this just isn’t cutting it, and we’re going to have to call it quits here. It sucked, it really did, it wasn’t a fun experience, but like Vitaly said, keeping that standard very high and at the same time allowing people to have fun with it, I’m happier now that the experience happened, because I know that the thing that I’m going to end up reading on Smashing Magazine is going to be really, really good.
I didn't mention this, but I've written three articles for Smashing Magazine, two of which had been published. One was rejected, and I spent quite a bit of time working on the rejected one. It was for accessibility, and I wanted to just write about introduction stuff — like if you are working on a site or an application, here's the stuff that you do. The editor was very nice and offered suggestions; I worked on a second draft, and he came back and said, Sorry, this just isn't cutting it, and we're going to have to call it quits here. It sucked, it really did, it wasn't a fun experience, but like Vitaly said, keeping that standard very high and at the same time allowing people to have fun with it, I'm happier now that the experience happened, because I know that the thing that I'm going to end up reading on Smashing Magazine is going to be really, really good.
It’s a very intense process, and anyone who has written for Smashing Magazine certainly knows, it’s incredibly rewarding once it’s published, because you see this beautifully chiseled sort of publication that … I don’t usually get the grammar and spelling perfectly when I send it to the editor, but what comes out is just this beautifully molded sculpture from the lump of clay that I usually send to them. It’s always exciting to see.
It's a very intense process, and anyone who has written for Smashing Magazine certainly knows, it's incredibly rewarding once it's published, because you see this beautifully chiseled sort of publication that … I don't usually get the grammar and spelling perfectly when I send it to the editor, but what comes out is just this beautifully molded sculpture from the lump of clay that I usually send to them. It's always exciting to see.
David: 大卫：One of the things that caught my attention was the fact that Vitaly comes from Russia, and he’s working in multiple languages, and he’s researching content from all around the world. And I know, I’ve gone to websites in different countries, and I’ve used the automatic Google translation so that I could read things in Japanese or Chinese or Russian or Korean or whatever was out there. But I’ve noticed that the interfaces, the development, the way people are approaching things, there is a difference, and it’s because a lot of these things don’t get communicated across different language barriers. It’s interesting that he’s chosen to take that on as a challenge — to try to bring in writers who come from different back grounds with different languages and translate those pieces and bring them in for an English-speaking audience with Smashing Magazine.
One of the things that caught my attention was the fact that Vitaly comes from Russia, and he's working in multiple languages, and he's researching content from all around the world. And I know, I've gone to websites in different countries, and I've used the automatic Google translation so that I could read things in Japanese or Chinese or Russian or Korean or whatever was out there. But I've noticed that the interfaces, the development, the way people are approaching things, there is a difference, and it's because a lot of these things don't get communicated across different language barriers. It's interesting that he's chosen to take that on as a challenge — to try to bring in writers who come from different back grounds with different languages and translate those pieces and bring them in for an English-speaking audience with Smashing Magazine.
Tim: 蒂姆：Yeah. I was very curious about that. From my own experience, being that I only speak one language, every sort of advice and anything that I look for is in English typically from an American or UK writer, and that’s pretty much where I get all of my information. I usually naïvely don’t think about how there are entire other continents wherein people with just an insane amount of experience and different challenges for different devices are writing about the same things and have a new perspective that’s just not even in my mental space. I’m very curious to hear more about that, and just learn more about what people are doing all over the world.
是的 I was very curious about that. From my own experience, being that I only speak one language, every sort of advice and anything that I look for is in English typically from an American or UK writer, and that's pretty much where I get all of my information. I usually naïvely don't think about how there are entire other continents wherein people with just an insane amount of experience and different challenges for different devices are writing about the same things and have a new perspective that's just not even in my mental space. I'm very curious to hear more about that, and just learn more about what people are doing all over the world.
David [32:37]: David [32:37]:What I wanted to learn more about — and we didn’t get a chance to ask him for more details about this — was that set of editorial guidelines that he must follow, because he was talking about how it may not be something that every author reads, but it becomes the guiding light that stands behind all of their work. Their editors obviously work from it, and it brings me back to my own work with agile, and the importance of a team having a strong definition of done. This seems like it establishes what is it that distinguishes an article for this particular publication from all of those other articles out there. It’s something that we as readers, and you as a writer, you can see the difference, but it’s nice to know that it’s written down somewhere, that it’s tangible. And I’m going to go and I’m going to read those authors guidelines, because I’m curious now.
What I wanted to learn more about — and we didn't get a chance to ask him for more details about this — was that set of editorial guidelines that he must follow, because he was talking about how it may not be something that every author reads, but it becomes the guiding light that stands behind all of their work. Their editors obviously work from it, and it brings me back to my own work with agile, and the importance of a team having a strong definition of done. This seems like it establishes what is it that distinguishes an article for this particular publication from all of those other articles out there. It's something that we as readers, and you as a writer, you can see the difference, but it's nice to know that it's written down somewhere, that it's tangible. And I'm going to go and I'm going to read those authors guidelines , because I'm curious now.
Tim: 蒂姆：Yeah. I almost get the feeling that, as much of a rich architecture and, I’m going to say, store front that you see for Smashing Magazine, I feel like there’s just as much on the inside that you don’t see — in terms of culture between editors, and the guidelines that they follow, and what they talk about amongst themselves, and how the panel sort of judges the articles. I always sort of get this feeling from looking at Smashing Magazine that there’s just this rich, vibrant exterior. But what you don’t see, I think, is just as interesting and just as deep, and I’m very curious to see how that team approaches an article from start to finish. Yeah, definitely what those guidelines are and how they sort of rank these articles. Because whatever they’re doing clearly works, and is continuously producing just amazing content.
是的 I almost get the feeling that, as much of a rich architecture and, I'm going to say, store front that you see for Smashing Magazine, I feel like there's just as much on the inside that you don't see — in terms of culture between editors, and the guidelines that they follow, and what they talk about amongst themselves, and how the panel sort of judges the articles. I always sort of get this feeling from looking at Smashing Magazine that there's just this rich, vibrant exterior. But what you don't see, I think, is just as interesting and just as deep, and I'm very curious to see how that team approaches an article from start to finish. Yeah, definitely what those guidelines are and how they sort of rank these articles. Because whatever they're doing clearly works, and is continuously producing just amazing content.
David: 大卫：I know Smashing Magazine is a place I go to if I want to read something that’s long and in depth and that’s really going to answer all of the questions. I mean there are other places like, I don’t know, maybe SitePoint that I might go to if I want to get a tutorial that’s going to explain to me a specific technology, that’s going to go into detail about these things. And also we have courseware and such. It’s interesting to see how there’s really a place online for all of these different ways of publishing information, and how people gravitate to one or gravitate to another, depending on what they’re looking for.
I know Smashing Magazine is a place I go to if I want to read something that's long and in depth and that's really going to answer all of the questions. I mean there are other places like, I don't know, maybe SitePoint that I might go to if I want to get a tutorial that's going to explain to me a specific technology, that's going to go into detail about these things. And also we have courseware and such. It's interesting to see how there's really a place online for all of these different ways of publishing information, and how people gravitate to one or gravitate to another, depending on what they're looking for.
Tim: 蒂姆：Yeah. I’m trying to think about how I do it, because I do pull from so many different sources. For example, a lot of times if I want to read super long formal, I either go to A List Apart or Smashing Magazine, and A list Apart is usually more on the philosophical side, occasionally getting into specific technical details, whereas Smashing Magazine is long form and mostly technical. In my case, I’m reading the coding specific articles. Then I’ll go to SitePoint, for example, if I’m working on a specific library and I need to know how to do this one thing — or in my case, I sometimes write a lot about philosophical subjects on SitePoint, under the Web channel. And then, sometimes I’ll go to the Pony Foo blog, wherein there’s just sort of everything: there’s philosophical, there’s long form, there’s short form, there’s strange techniques and takes on writing different libraries and codes that I’ve never thought of before. Then of course, there’s CSS-Tricks, wherein all of the different how-to-do-this-on-the-front-end and making-this-cool-thing-little-trick-in-CSS — because that’s the name of the site.
是的 I'm trying to think about how I do it, because I do pull from so many different sources. For example, a lot of times if I want to read super long formal, I either go to A List Apart or Smashing Magazine, and A list Apart is usually more on the philosophical side, occasionally getting into specific technical details, whereas Smashing Magazine is long form and mostly technical. In my case, I'm reading the coding specific articles. Then I'll go to SitePoint, for example, if I'm working on a specific library and I need to know how to do this one thing — or in my case, I sometimes write a lot about philosophical subjects on SitePoint, under the Web channel . And then, sometimes I'll go to the Pony Foo blog, wherein there's just sort of everything: there's philosophical, there's long form, there's short form, there's strange techniques and takes on writing different libraries and codes that I've never thought of before. Then of course, there's CSS-Tricks , wherein all of the different how-to-do-this-on-the-front-end and making-this-cool-thing-little-trick-in-CSS — because that's the name of the site.
But yeah, there are so many resources out there, and each one of (of the big five to six that I look at) seems to offer their own unique perspective on all sorts of different tasks and philosophies. That really is interesting how in the space there’s not just this one sort of corporate this is how you do this thing and this is where you look for information.
But yeah, there are so many resources out there, and each one of (of the big five to six that I look at) seems to offer their own unique perspective on all sorts of different tasks and philosophies. That really is interesting how in the space there's not just this one sort of corporate this is how you do this thing and this is where you look for information .
David [36:22]: David [36:22]:As long as publishers like Vitaly are willing to hold on to their independence and not sell out to one aggregator that’s going to create a single unified thing, I think that that’s a benefit to everybody, because that way we get the advantage of being able to see all of these different perspectives.
As long as publishers like Vitaly are willing to hold on to their independence and not sell out to one aggregator that's going to create a single unified thing, I think that that's a benefit to everybody, because that way we get the advantage of being able to see all of these different perspectives.
It’s really interesting that he was talking about how it started with these resource links — like 45 wallpapers, et cetera — and how that’s how he built up all of that traffic. And then he pivoted, and went to the next version, where it becomes this rich content source for long-form articles, but he lost traffic and gained credibility in the process.
It's really interesting that he was talking about how it started with these resource links — like 45 wallpapers, et cetera — and how that's how he built up all of that traffic. And then he pivoted, and went to the next version, where it becomes this rich content source for long-form articles, but he lost traffic and gained credibility in the process.
Tim: 蒂姆：Yeah, it’s almost like a catalog that offers coupons suddenly publishing articles on real, in-depth journalistic stories or something like that. Like, my coupons are gone, I’m not going to look at this anymore — but then you get this whole audience that is like, Wow, this is amazing and really helpful content that I enjoy, so let me stick around for this.
Yeah, it's almost like a catalog that offers coupons suddenly publishing articles on real, in-depth journalistic stories or something like that. Like, my coupons are gone, I'm not going to look at this anymore — but then you get this whole audience that is like, Wow, this is amazing and really helpful content that I enjoy, so let me stick around for this.
David: 大卫：I’m glad that you invited Vitaly on the show, and I didn’t realize that you’d worked with him before. But fantastic guest, and I’m sure that our listeners are going to learn a lot from having had the opportunity to hear what he has to say.
I'm glad that you invited Vitaly on the show, and I didn't realize that you'd worked with him before. But fantastic guest, and I'm sure that our listeners are going to learn a lot from having had the opportunity to hear what he has to say.
Tim: 蒂姆：Yeah, I’m looking forward to it. For those of our listeners who haven’t been, do check out the Smashing Conf, which happens all over the world, really. They do it in a whole bunch of places. One that I most recently went to was the one that was in New York City. It was incredible; there were a ton of really high profile guests, and just amazing talks. I learned a ton. I would’ve stayed there for a whole week, but it was only three days. Do check that out if you get the chance.
Yeah, I'm looking forward to it. For those of our listeners who haven't been, do check out the Smashing Conf , which happens all over the world, really. They do it in a whole bunch of places. One that I most recently went to was the one that was in New York City. It was incredible; there were a ton of really high profile guests, and just amazing talks. I learned a ton. I would've stayed there for a whole week, but it was only three days. Do check that out if you get the chance.
David: 大卫：Cool. All right.
凉。 行。
Tim: 蒂姆：Well, thank you so much for listening, everybody. We always enjoy getting to talk technology with all of you.
好，非常感谢大家的倾听。 我们总是喜欢与大家交谈技术。
David: 大卫：We would also like to thank SitePoint.com, and our producers, Adam Roberts and Ophelie Lechat. Please feel free to send us your comments on Twitter — @versioningshow — and give us a rating on iTunes, and let us know how we’re doing.
We would also like to thank SitePoint.com , and our producers, Adam Roberts and Ophelie Lechat. Please feel free to send us your comments on Twitter — @versioningshow — and give us a rating on iTunes , and let us know how we're doing.
Tim: 蒂姆：We’ll see you next time, and we hope you enjoyed this version.
下次见，我们希望您喜欢这个版本。
翻译自: https://www.sitepoint.com/versioning-show-episode-11-with-vitaly-friedman/
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