SitePoint播客＃65：是否拥有IE6？

tech2023-12-03 24

Episode 65 of The SitePoint Podcast is now available! This week your hosts are Patrick O’Keefe (@iFroggy), Stephan Segraves (@ssegraves), Brad Williams (@williamsba), and Kevin Yank (@sentience).

SitePoint Podcast的第65集现已发布！本周的主持人是Patrick O'Keefe( @iFroggy )，Stephan Segraves( @ssegraves )，Brad Williams( @williamsba )和Kevin Yank( @sentience )。

下载此剧集 (Download this Episode)

You can also download this episode as a standalone MP3 file. Here’s the link:

您也可以将本集下载为独立的MP3文件。这是链接：

SitePoint Podcast #65: Got IE6? (MP3, 54.4MB, 59:21)

SitePoint播客＃65：是否拥有IE6？ (MP3，54.4MB，59:21)

剧集摘要 (Episode Summary)

Here are the topics covered in this episode:

以下是本集中介绍的主题：

Update: Twitter Going to OAuth Affects Chinese Web Users

更新：Twitter即将使用OAuth影响中国网络用户 Browser news #1: Google Chrome 5 out, no longer beta on Mac, but not accessible?

浏览器新闻＃1：Google Chrome 5退出，不再在Mac上进行Beta测试，但无法访问吗？ Browser news #2: IE8 Growth Outpacing Chrome, IE Still Shrinking Overall Due To IE6

浏览器新闻2：IE8的增长速度超过了Chrome，由于IE6，IE总体上仍在萎缩 Browser news #3: Safari 5 Released, with HTML5 Showcase

浏览器新闻3：Safari 5发布，HTML5展示 The value of learning multiple web development languages

学习多种Web开发语言的价值 Smokescreen: a Flash-to-HTML5/JavaScript compiler

Smokescreen：Flash-to-HTML5 / JavaScript编译器

Browse the full list of links referenced in the show at http://delicious.com/sitepointpodcast/65.

浏览http://delicious.com/sitepointpodcast/65中显示的参考链接的完整列表。

主持人聚光灯 (Host Spotlights)

Patrick: Real Time Search – Social Mention

帕特里克：实时搜索-社交提及

Stephan: Safari Extensions

Stephan： Safari扩展

Brad: HTML5 Experiment: Visualizing the Stanley Cup

布拉德： HTML5实验：可视化史丹利杯

Kevin: ShowSlow monitors your YSlow and Google Page Speed scores

凯文： ShowSlow监控您的YSlow和Google Page Speed得分

显示成绩单 (Show Transcript)

Kevin: June 11th, 2010. Tons of browser news and plenty of controversy mixed in. I’m Kevin Yank and this is the SitePoint Podcast #65: Got IE6?

凯文(Kevin)： 2010年6月11日。浏览器新闻不胜枚举，争议纷至mixed来。我是凯文·扬克(Kevin Yank)，这是SitePoint播客65：IE6吗？

And we have tons of browser news to get through today. It seems like all the browser news hit in the past two weeks, so we’ve got lots of stuff to talk about. A little meatier than usual, though; it seems like every single piece of browser news came with its own little bit of controversy, so we’ll dig in to all of that.

今天，我们有大量的浏览器新闻。在过去的两周中，似乎所有浏览器新闻都受到关注，因此我们有很多事情要谈。不过，比平常略带肉。似乎每个浏览器新闻都带有其自身的一点争议，因此我们将深入探讨所有这些。

But before we do, guys, we got a response to our last episode on Twitter where, and I apologize if I’m pronouncing this incorrectly, Jarón Barends asks, “Regarding Twitter’s OAuth move,” and I think two weeks ago we said we had five weeks and counting before Twitter switched off basic authentication and switched to OAuth, he asks, “did you know the negative effect for users in censored countries?” And he pointed us at his excellent, I have to say, blog post on this subject, and to be honest this hadn’t occurred to me.

但是，在这样做之前，伙计们，我们对Twitter上的最后一集做出了回应，我很抱歉如果我的发音不正确， JarónBarends问道，“关于Twitter的OAuth行动”，我想两周前我们说过他问，在关闭Twitter的基本身份验证并切换到OAuth之前，还有五个星期的时间，他在问：“您是否知道受审查国家/地区的用户所受到的负面影响？” 他向我们指出了他关于该主题的出色博客文章，并且老实说这并不是我想到的。

This is — did you guys read this?

这是-你们读过吗？

Stephan: I did.

史蒂芬：我做到了。

Patrick: I did. It hadn’t occurred to me either.

帕特里克：我做到了。我也没有发生过。

Kevin: Yeah. It’s kind of an issue to do with OAuth in general, and let me break it down here for our listeners, and then you guys can discuss what you think of this. But the issue here is that, whereas previously where basic authentication meant that if you wanted to use Twitter through some third party site you just gave that third party site your Twitter username and password and that third party site would then connect to Twitter on its own using your credentials to do whatever it wanted. That seems like a poor security choice and something we would want to avoid, and the OAuth move is all about getting around that so that you never give out your Twitter credentials to anyone except Twitter. If you want to grant access for a third party site to access your Twitter account, what you do is tell that third party site, “Hey, I want to give you access,” that third party site redirects you to a special page on the Twitter website that prompts you to log in to Twitter using that Twitter supplied page and then Twitter supplies the third party site with a token that grants it access to your account. So that third party site never sees your Twitter credentials.

凯文：是的。通常，与OAuth有关是一个问题，让我在这里为我们的侦听器细分一下，然后大家可以讨论您对此的看法。但是这里的问题是，而以前的基本身份验证意味着，如果您想通过某个第三方站点使用Twitter，则只需向该第三方站点提供您的Twitter用户名和密码，然后该第三方站点将自行连接到Twitter。使用您的凭据执行所需的任何操作。这似乎是一个糟糕的安全选择，是我们要避免的事情，而OAuth的举动就是解决这一问题，因此您绝不会向除Twitter之外的任何人提供Twitter凭据。如果您想授予第三方站点访问您的Twitter帐户的权限，您要做的就是告诉第三方站点“嘿，我想给您访问权限”，该第三方站点会将您重定向到页面上的特殊页面。 Twitter网站，提示您使用该Twitter提供的页面登录到Twitter，然后Twitter向第三方网站提供令牌，以授予其访问您的帐户的权限。因此，该第三方站点永远不会看到您的Twitter凭据。

This is a good thing, it’s pretty widely agreed, except the issue is that now in order to connect to Twitter from a third party site you need to go to the Twitter website at some point to do it, to grant it that access. And if you unfortunately find yourself in a country like China that blocks access to sites like Twitter, suddenly you can no longer use not only Twitter but any of these third party sites.

这是一件好事，已经得到了广泛的同意，除了问题在于，现在为了从第三方站点连接到Twitter，您需要在某个时候访问Twitter网站以授予访问权限。而且，如果您不幸地发现自己所在的国家(如中国)阻止了Twitter之类的网站的访问，突然之间，您不仅不能再使用Twitter，还不能再使用任何这些第三方网站。

And this doesn’t just affect people in these blocked countries, I know that my partner works at a school where sites like Twitter are blocked, and I have friends whose offices block the Twitter website, and I just tell them, hey, go to sites like Hahlo, hahlo.com, which is a third party interface for Twitter, and you can just log in with your Twitter account there to use Twitter, and that one’s not blocked and they get in that way. As soon as this OAuth thing happens that’s no longer going to be an option for those people.

这不仅会影响这些被封锁国家的人们，我知道我的合伙人在一所学校中工作，该学校封锁了Twitter之类的网站，我有一些朋友的办公室封锁了Twitter网站，我只是告诉他们，嘿，去像Hahlo， hahlo.com这样的网站，它是Twitter的第三方界面，您可以在其中使用您的Twitter帐户登录以使用Twitter，但该帐户没有被阻止，因此受到干扰。一旦发生OAuth事件，对于那些人来说就不再是一种选择。

What do you think? Is this a huge flaw in OAuth?

你怎么看？这是OAuth的巨大缺陷吗？

Brad: I guess the big question is, is this Twitter’s responsibility or the website’s responsibility or is it the country’s responsibility? I mean can we expect every website to make exceptions because certain countries are blocking that website?

布拉德：我想最大的问题是，这是Twitter的责任还是网站的责任，还是国家的责任？我的意思是，我们可以指望每个网站都会因为某些国家/地区阻止该网站而例外吗？

Patrick: Yeah, I don’t think that’s reasonable, I really don’t. I don’t like entitlement in general, and that just seems to be entitlement, but at the same time it is an interesting dilemma for Twitter because Twitter has in part championed itself, and has been championed by others, as this sort of bastion or conduit of free speech in countries that otherwise wouldn’t have it. And how people have access to it and can get information out there quickly in disasters, in situations where the government is censoring them, so they’ve kind of become a pet, in a way, I mean they’ve had interaction with the government tied to these sorts of cultural movements and things that they are bringing light to. So they have sort of a different responsibility, let’s say, than other websites, maybe not a responsibility but how they view themselves and their image as a part of the world I guess. So I don’t think it’s a problem with OAuth, see, this is — we’re in the U.S. and Kevin’s in Australia, and we don’t have those sorts of problems. Like we think OAuth is great because, for example, TwitPic, a very popular Twitter service that allows you to share pictures, for a long time until just very recently in the last couple months made you log in with a username and password, and there were tons of people who would say that’s insecure, why am I giving them my username and password? Now they finally made the leap to OAuth, but, and we don’t think of those other problems with other countries because we don’t have to deal with them. But it is interesting, and I don’t know if they should make an exception or if it’s just not worth doing because of their security of their system.

帕特里克：是的，我认为这不合理，我真的不知道。我一般不喜欢应享权利，这似乎只是应享权利，但与此同时，这对Twitter来说是一个有趣的困境，因为Twitter在某种程度上拥护自己，并受到其他人的拥护，例如这种堡垒或在其他国家没有言论自由的国家进行言论自由的渠道。以及人们在灾难中，政府正在对其进行审查的情况下人们如何访问它以及如何Swift获得信息，因此他们有点像宠物，在某种程度上，我的意思是他们已经与政府进行了互动与这些文化运动及其所带来的事物联系在一起。因此，与其他网站相比，他们承担的责任有所不同，也许不是责任，而是我认为自己如何看待自己和自己的形象成为世界的一部分。因此，我认为OAuth没问题，这是-我们在美国，在凯文在澳大利亚，我们没有这类问题。就像我们认为OAuth之所以出色，是因为TwitPic是一种非常受欢迎的Twitter服务，它允许您共享图片很长时间，直到最近几个月才使您使用用户名和密码登录，有很多人会说这是不安全的，为什么我要给他们我的用户名和密码？现在，他们终于实现了OAuth的飞跃，但是，我们不必考虑其他国家/地区的其他问题，因为我们不必处理它们。但这很有趣，而且我不知道他们是否应该例外，或者由于他们系统的安全性而不值得这样做。

Kevin: You’re right, this is an issue for free speech all over the world, and Twitter made a big deal about the fact, and during the Iranian elections people were Twittering about the election fraud that they were observing and that was a huge deal, it made headlines all over the world. And if that had occurred after this switch to OAuth then the moment that the Iran government decided to clamp down and block access to Twitter that avenue of free speech would just disappear.

凯文：你是对的，这是全世界言论自由的问题，推特对此事进行了很多讨论，在伊朗大选期间，人们在推特上谈论他们所观察到的选举欺诈，这是一个巨大的问题。这笔交易在世界范围内成为头条新闻。如果这种情况是在改用OAuth之后发生的，那么当伊朗政府决定压制并阻止访问Twitter的那一刻，言论自由之路就会消失。

Like I totally agree that OAuth is way more secure and requiring third party services that want access to people’s Twitter accounts, to offer OAuth as an option makes absolute sense. But does requiring them to only use OAuth make sense? Should maybe they allow people to give OAuth as the default login method but have a “I would like to log in insecurely” option for people for whom OAuth isn’t an option?

就像我完全同意的那样，OAuth的方式更加安全，并且需要希望访问人们的Twitter帐户的第三方服务，将OAuth作为一种选择是绝对有意义的。但是要求他们仅使用OAuth是否有意义？也许他们应该允许人们将OAuth作为默认的登录方法，但是为那些不能选择OAuth的人们提供“我想不安全地登录”选项？

Patrick: (laughs) I’d like to see that link: log in insecurely. That’d be a great link to have in your header, like log in secure, log in insecure. No, I think here’s the thing, I think that’s a good idea but I think there’s no right decision here, there’s just a decision. So on one hand you have that would allow people to — something like that which would allow people to login in that manner and take the risk. And then, of course, you have the other hand of Twitter where I’m sure they have support problems where people give their information to some party and then their other account gets hacked or it’s spammed with messages, and then they complain to who? Twitter. So Twitter has to deal with that. Now, is that risk, does that outweigh the benefit of maybe making an option available for people to log in with a username and password? I don’t know. I think Twitter, like I said, is a special circumstance so maybe they should do something like that and then just accept, I guess, the consequences of having some people be taken advantage of.

帕特里克：(笑)我想看看那个链接：不安全地登录。这将是标题中的绝佳链接，例如安全登录，不安全登录。不，我认为这是事情，我认为这是个好主意，但我认为这里没有正确的决定，只有一个决定。因此，一方面，您将拥有允许人们登录的功能-类似于允许人们以这种方式登录并承担风险的功能。然后，当然，还有Twitter的另一只手，我确定他们遇到了支持问题，即人们向某方提供信息，然后其他帐户遭到黑客入侵或垃圾邮件，然后他们向谁抱怨？推特。因此，Twitter必须对此进行处理。现在，这种风险是否超过了使用户可以使用用户名和密码登录的选项的好处？我不知道。我认为，就像我说的那样，Twitter是一种特殊情况，所以也许他们应该做类似的事情，然后我接受那些被某些人利用的后果。

Kevin: Hmm. For people who are concerned that they’re going to lose their access to Twitter whether because they’re in a country that doesn’t allow it or whether they just work at an office that has clamped down on that particular service, there are work arounds; in order to log in to a third party site that needs access to your Twitter account, using OAuth you only need to get to Twitter once to do that initial login to grant the access and get that token. So if you can somehow get yourself temporary access to Twitter, whether it’s using your home computer if your office is keeping you from accessing it, once you grant that third party site access from home then you can use it at work. If you don’t easily have access to a computer that isn’t blocked then you need to start looking at some of these Internet anonymization tools that allow you to surf anonymously and break through various firewalls which may or may not be an option for you depending on how risky you like to make your Internet access.

凯文：嗯。对于那些担心因为自己身处不允许的国家或仅在限制该特定服务的办公室工作而失去对Twitter的访问权限的人，这里有工作周围为了登录需要访问您的Twitter帐户的第三方站点，使用OAuth，您只需访问一次Twitter即可进行该初始登录以授予访问权限并获得该令牌。因此，如果您能以某种方式使自己临时访问Twitter，无论它是在使用家用计算机(如果您的办公室阻止您访问它)，一旦从家中授予了第三方站点访问权限，您就可以在工作中使用它。如果您无法轻松访问未受阻止的计算机，则需要开始查看其中的一些Internet匿名化工具，这些工具可让您匿名浏览并突破各种防火墙，对于您而言，可能是，也可能不是具体取决于您希望访问互联网的风险。

Patrick: We’re not saying you should break into the U.S. or Australian embassies, we’re not saying that at all. (laughs)

帕特里克(Patrick)：我们并不是说您应该闯入美国或澳大利亚的使馆，我们也不是说那样。 (笑)

Kevin: (laughs) No, definitely not. But, yeah, it’s a concern; it’s weird how what is hailed widely as progress, this move to OAuth, is causing problems in certain ways. And, yeah, you know if it was just a small segment of users, you know, if it was Internet Explorer users, for example, who could not use OAuth, that would be one thing.

凯文：(笑)不，绝对不是。但是，是的，这令人担忧。奇怪的是，随着向OAuth的发展，这种进展在某些方面引起了问题。而且，是的，您知道这是否只是一小部分用户，例如，如果是不能使用OAuth的Internet Explorer用户，那将是一回事。

Patrick: Oh, would it!

帕特里克：哦，会的！

Kevin: Not that Internet Explorer users are a small segment, but let’s cut it down to Internet Explorer 6 users then; let’s just say IE6 couldn’t access OAuth, people would go, “Ah, you know, you take the good with the bad.” But when the bad is something that has such big ramifications for free speech in the world, yeah, it’s a concern.

凯文：并不是说Internet Explorer用户只是一小部分，但让我们将其缩减为Internet Explorer 6用户。假设IE6无法访问OAuth，人们会说：“啊，你知道好坏了。” 但是，当坏消息对世界范围内的言论自由产生重大影响时，是的，这是一个令人担忧的问题。

Anyway, thank you for bringing that to our attention, Jarón, that was really interesting reading.

无论如何，Jarón感谢您引起我们的注意，这真的很有趣。

But I think it’s time to dive into the browser news, guys. Brad you’re our resident Chrome expert, we hear there’s a new version of Chrome.

伙计们，但我认为是时候深入了解浏览器新闻了。布拉德，您是我们的常驻Chrome专家，我们听说有一个新版本的Chrome。

Brad: Yeah, another month, another new version of Chrome, so Chrome 5 was just released at the end of May, and if you’re running Chrome you probably already have it and you may not even realize it. Like me, I forgot that Chrome auto-upgrades you when new versions come out, so they don’t actually give you the — they don’t say, “Hey, a new version!” It just downloads and installs, so all of a sudden you’re running Chrome 5 and this is what we kind of discussed on those upgrade patterns a couple shows ago, how the Chrome 3 pretty much dropped down to nothing the day that Chrome 4 was out, or within a few days of it, which is pretty interesting.

布拉德：是的，再过一个月，又是另一个新版本的Chrome，因此Chrome 5才于5月底发布，如果您正在运行Chrome，则可能已经拥有它，甚至可能没有意识到。像我一样，我忘了Chrome会在新版本问世时自动为您升级，因此它们实际上并没有为您提供-他们不会说“嘿，新版本！” 它只是下载并安装，所以突然之间您正在运行Chrome 5，这就是我们在几对之前展示的那些升级模式中所讨论的内容，Chrome 3在Chrome 4诞生的那一天几乎没有下降或几天之内，这很有趣。

Today I was going through some of the new features of Chrome 5, and some of the cooler things are some of the HTML5 features that they’ve added in, including geolocation API’s, the app cache web sockets, and also drag and drop which Gmail now takes advantage of; so you can actually compose a new email in Gmail and you can drag files off your desktop directly into the email on Gmail and attach those files, which is really cool to see in action on a big app like that.

今天，我经历了Chrome 5的一些新功能，其中一些更酷的功能是它们添加的一些HTML5功能，包括地理位置API，应用程序缓存Web套接字，以及拖放了哪些Gmail现在利用；因此，您实际上可以在Gmail中撰写新电子邮件，并且可以将文件从桌面直接拖到Gmail上的电子邮件中并附加这些文件，这对于在大型应用程序上运行时真的很酷。

Kevin: Hmm-mm. So you were saying before the show that you barely even noticed, or you didn’t even notice that you got a new version of Chrome. So that auto update is definitely working.

凯文：嗯。因此，您在演出前说的是，您几乎没有注意到它，或者甚至没有注意到您有了新版本的Chrome。因此，自动更新绝对有效。

Brad: It’s definitely, in fact, I just checked to make sure and sure enough I’m running 5 and I didn’t even realize it. So, I mean it’s working.

布拉德：确实，事实上，我只是检查了一下，以确保自己正在运行5，而我什至没有意识到。所以，我的意思是它正在工作。

Kevin: I love that. I am all for that I have to say. The fact that every time the make the slightest release they upgrade the major version number is a bit — who are they trying to catch up with?

凯文：我喜欢。我只想说些什么。每次发布最小版本时，他们都会升级主要版本号，这一事实有点-他们想追赶谁？

Brad: They’re going to be on Chrome 10 by the end of the year.

布拉德：他们将在今年年底使用Chrome 10。

Kevin: I guess Internet Explorer, right?

凯文：我猜是Internet Explorer，对不对？

Patrick: Well, you gotta remember, what was that stat, like ten percent of people know what a browser is? You have to think if those same people, 90 percent can probably be convinced that 10.0 anything is better than 5.0 of something else.

帕特里克：嗯，你要记住，那是什么统计数据，就像百分之十的人知道浏览器是什么一样？您必须考虑，如果这些人相同，那么90％的人可能会说服10.0的任何事物都比其他事物的5.0更好。

Kevin: Yeah, I guess so.

凯文：是的，我想是的。

Patrick: AOL 10.0.

帕特里克：美国在线10.0。

Kevin: We don’t need the, “Ooh, you must make sure to download version 3.6.2 because it’s so much better than 3.6.1,” so I applaud them having sort of real world version numbers, but the cynic in me says they’re just trying to catch up to Internet Explorer 8 as quickly as possible, and once they get there they’ll level off their version numbers.

凯文：我们不需要，“哦，您必须确保下载3.6.2版，因为它比3.6.1更好。”因此，我为他们拥有真实世界的版本号而称赞，但愤世嫉俗表示他们只是想尽快赶上Internet Explorer 8，一旦到达该网站，他们就会升级其版本号。

Brad: Yeah, they’ve also increased the syncing feature so prior to this version you could synch bookmarks but now you can also sync browser preferences, your themes, your home page, your startup settings, your preferred language, and even zoom settings. So that’s kind of an interesting feature. You know, I really like what they’re doing with the sync because you know most of us have multiple computers we use and it’s such a pain that all of our browsers are, you know, we have different add-ons or extensions here and there and trying to keep everything in sync, so it looks like they’re really moving along with that, which is great.

布拉德：是的，他们还增加了同步功能，因此在此版本之前，您可以同步书签，但是现在您还可以同步浏览器首选项，主题，主页，启动设置，首选语言，甚至缩放设置。因此，这是一个有趣的功能。您知道，我真的很喜欢他们对同步所做的事情，因为您知道我们大多数人使用的是多台计算机，而且所有我们的浏览器都在这里拥有不同的加载项或扩展程序，这让我非常痛苦。并尝试使所有内容保持同步，因此看起来他们真的在与时俱进，这很棒。

Kevin: Yeah. Reading the announcement from Google I found it interesting, once again, not to harp on this too much, but the fluid definition of HTML5 rears its head here again. They mention I think you said geolocation as one of the HTML5 features that they added support for, and that’s just another example of one more feature being lumped in under the heading of HTML5. If you go to isgeolocationpartofhtml5.com you’ll get a really nice website that has a map on it and a big word bubble that says “NO” in it. Because, yeah, geolocation technically is a completely separate W3C specification from HTML5, and yet once again as a new web standard that just seems to be all it takes to be considered part of HTML5 these days.

凯文：是的。阅读Google的公告后，我再次发现它很有趣，不要对此过多地竖琴，但是HTML5流畅的定义再次引起了人们的注意。他们提到我认为您说地理定位是他们添加了支持HTML5功能之一，而这只是在HTML5标题下加入了另一个功能的另一个示例。如果您访问isgeolocationpartofhtml5.com，您将获得一个非常漂亮的网站，上面带有地图，并且带有一个大气泡，上面写着“否”。是的，因为从技术上讲，地理定位是与HTML5完全分开的W3C规范，但再次成为新的Web标准，这似乎已经成为当今HTML5的全部内容。

But I mentioned that each of these news stories related to a new browser comes with its own bit of controversy, and this one, the Chrome 5 in addition to all of the new features it brings, is the first non-beta version for the Mac. And that seems to be leading a few Mac users to judge it a little more harshly than previous releases because, after all, Google is not stingy with its beta labels, and so you would expect once they removed that beta term that they would be pretty confident that it’s a fully formed product. And yet we have this — the Mac-cessibility network site is reporting that Google Chrome for Mac seems to go out of its way to remove accessibility features from the browser. After all, the Chrome browser is built around the same Webkit rendering engine that Safari is, and Webkit comes with a whole rich set of accessibility features specifically tooled for the Mac platform so that visually disabled people are able to access websites using the Voiceover technology that’s built into Mac OS X. And it looks like Google Chrome has basically switched off all those features, and that’s what this blog post is complaining about.

但是我提到，与新浏览器相关的所有新闻报导都有其自身的争议，而Chrome 5以及它带来的所有新功能，都是Mac的第一个非Beta版本。。这似乎使一些Mac用户比以前的版本更加苛刻，因为Google毕竟对其beta标签并不beta，因此您希望他们删除了beta版本后，他们会很漂亮。有信心这是一个完整的产品。然而，我们有这个问题-Mac上的可访问性网站报告说，Mac版Google Chrome似乎已竭尽全力从浏览器中删除可访问性功能。毕竟，Chrome浏览器是基于与Safari相同的Webkit呈现引擎构建的，并且Webkit带有一整套针对Mac平台专门设计的丰富的辅助功能，以便视障人士能够使用Voiceover技术访问网站。内置于Mac OS X中。看来Google Chrome浏览器已基本关闭了所有这些功能，而这正是本博客所抱怨的。

The comment thread for this post is especially illuminating because one of the developers on the Google Chrome team chimes in and says, “Look, it’s a little unfair to say that we just switched off all these features, that certainly isn’t what we did.” The issue is that the architecture of the Chrome web browser, which puts each of the tabs into its own separate process in order to improve the stability and security of the browser, that architecture choice made it really difficult for them to preserve access to those accessibility features in the rendering engine. After all, the browser process would have to communicate all of that accessibility information into the separate processes for each tab, and they have not yet been able to do that. He says they have a developer who is working on that specific issue, and they provide a bug number if you want to track their progress on that.

该帖子的评论线程特别具有启发性，因为Google Chrome团队的一位开发人员大声说：“看，说我们只是关闭了所有这些功能，这有点不公平，这肯定不是我们所做的。” 问题在于，Chrome Web浏览器的体系结构将每个选项卡置于其自己的独立过程中，以提高浏览器的稳定性和安全性，该体系结构的选择使他们很难保留对这些可访问性的访问呈现引擎中的功能。毕竟，浏览器进程将不得不将所有可访问性信息传达到每个选项卡的单独进程中，而他们尚无法做到这一点。他说他们有一个正在处理特定问题的开发人员，如果您想跟踪他们在此方面的进展，他们会提供一个错误号。

But what do you think guys? Is that an acceptable excuse that, you know, it was too hard and we’re still working on it when it comes to accessibility?

但是你们觉得呢？这是一个可以接受的借口吗？您知道吗？这太难了，在可访问性方面我们仍在努力吗？

Stephan: Why wouldn’t it be?

斯蒂芬：为什么不呢？

Stephan: I mean, you know, if something’s … gotta break some time, right? I mean when we’re developing software I think people understand that, so sure it stinks, and I think Google maybe should have been a little bit more forthcoming with why the features were gone, but other than that I mean it’s something that they’ve got to work out. Would you rather have a fast browser that works or a slow browser that has your accessibility features that you can’t use anyway because the browser’s too slow?

史蒂芬(Stephan)：我的意思是，你知道，如果某件事……必须休息一段时间，对吗？我的意思是，当我们开发软件时，我认为人们会理解这一点，因此请确保它发臭，而且我认为Google也许应该对功能消失的原因有所了解，但除此之外，我的意思是他们正在必须锻炼。您是希望运行一个快速的浏览器，还是运行一个缓慢的浏览器，但由于浏览器的速度太慢而无法使用您的可访问性功能？

Patrick: Depends on if you’re blind or not.

帕特里克：取决于您是否失明。

Kevin: Well, yeah, exactly.

凯文：是的，是的。

Stephan: But I’m saying is it unusable. I mean had they pushed it out and it was unusable would it matter then?

斯蒂芬：但是我说这是无法使用的。我的意思是，他们是否将其推出了，这是否有用呢？

Kevin: To visually impaired users I would say this browser is completely unusable, but those users would obviously then switch back to Safari where all of their features work. So I guess if it was the only browser, if there were no accessible browser available you might judge them a little more harshly. I think they probably should; if it’s understood that a web browser needs to be an accessible piece of software then the fact that Chrome is not, I think you’re right Stephan, that probably should have been highlighted as, you know, “accessibility features coming soon” or something like that. That part of it’s still in beta, please bear with us. But, yeah, I guess the fact that there is a good option sort of limits Google’s responsibility a little bit here. It’s good to know they’re working on it anyway.

凯文：对于视力不佳的用户，我会说此浏览器完全无法使用，但是这些用户显然会切换回使用所有功能的Safari。因此，我想这是否是唯一的浏览器，如果没有可用的可访问浏览器，您可能会更苛刻地判断它们。我认为他们可能应该这样做；如果了解到网络浏览器需要是一种可访问的软件，那么事实并非如此，Chrome浏览器并非如此，我认为您是正确的斯蒂芬(Stephan)，这应该被突出显示为“即将推出可访问性功能”之类的东西。像那样。该部分仍处于测试阶段，请耐心等待。但是，是的，我想有一个不错的选择可以在某种程度上限制Google的责任。很高兴知道他们仍在为此工作。

Stephan: Yeah. And the fact that a developer or a person that works for Google replied to this guy’s blog post says a lot, to me, at least.

斯蒂芬：是的。至少对我来说，开发人员或为Google工作的人回答了这个人的博客帖子这一事实。

Kevin: Yeah. Yeah, replied with their open bug tracker URL, I mean you’re not going to expect Microsoft to do that any time soon I’d say, so kudos on that front.

凯文：是的。是的，回答了他们的开放错误跟踪器URL，我的意思是您不会指望Microsoft会在不久的将来做到这一点，因此在这方面倍受赞誉。

Stephan: Or Apple, eh-hem.

史蒂芬：或者苹果公司，嗯。

Kevin: Yeah. Speaking of Microsoft, browser news number two is to do with the stats, the latest browser statistics surrounding Internet Explorer. And it’s a really interesting landscape at the moment. Looking at a story from Ars Technica, which I thought provided the best breakdown of these numbers that I could find, what we’re seeing here is that the latest browser numbers reveal Internet Explorer 8 is growing faster than Chrome, so Internet Explorer is still making great headways with their latest version. But the fact that use of older versions of Internet Explorer is shrinking even faster means that, overall, Internet Explorer use is still dropping. So I guess people on Internet Explorer 6 and 7 who are switching are making the choice of either going to Internet Explorer 8 or picking up something like Chrome which is the next fastest growing browser. And you’ve got to wonder, at Microsoft do they consider those people who are just stuck on Internet Explorer 6 to be their user base? I guess they do because they’re always talking about how they can’t break compatibility for people on old versions of Internet Explorer. But if people are abandoning your browser so quickly that even the massive growth you’re seeing in your latest version is seeing your overall user base shrinking day by day, that’s got to be kind of a depressing situation.

凯文：是的。对于微软而言，第二个浏览器新闻与统计信息有关，该统计信息是Internet Explorer的最新浏览器统计信息。目前，这是一个非常有趣的景观。看看Ars Technica的一个故事，我认为它提供了我能找到的这些数字的最好分类，我们在这里看到的是最新的浏览器数字显示Internet Explorer 8的增长速度快于Chrome，因此Internet Explorer仍然他们的最新版本取得了长足的进步。但是，较早版本的Internet Explorer的使用速度甚至在缩减，这一事实意味着，总体而言，Internet Explorer的使用仍在下降。因此，我猜想Internet Explorer 6和7上正在切换的人们正在选择转到Internet Explorer 8还是选择Chrome之类的东西，而Chrome是增长最快的浏览器。您一定想知道，在Microsoft，他们是否认为只是停留在Internet Explorer 6上的那些人是他们的用户群？我猜他们之所以这样做，是因为他们一直在谈论如何打破旧版本Internet Explorer上人们的兼容性。但是，如果人们如此Swift地放弃您的浏览器，以致即使您在最新版本中看到的巨大增长也正在使您的总体用户群每天都在减少，那肯定会令人沮丧。

Brad: Yeah, you know, the one stat I would like to see surrounded by IE 8 is how many people are actually upgrading to IE 8 versus how many people are installing Windows 7 or buying a new computer that has Windows 7 on it because it’s shipping with IE 8, and I would imagine a good percentage of the IE 8 users, or people who are moving to IE 8, is because they’re all moving to Windows 7.

布拉德：是的，您知道，我想看到的是IE 8的一项统计数据：实际上有多少人正在升级到IE 8，而有多少人正在安装Windows 7或购买装有Windows 7的新计算机，因为随同IE 8一起交付，我可以想象IE 8用户或迁移到IE 8的用户中有很大一部分是因为他们都已迁移到Windows 7。

Kevin: So do you think someone was on a previous version of Windows they had switched to Firefox, for example, and then they get their brand new computer, they fire it up, and it’s got Internet Explorer 8 on it and they’re about to go install Firefox and in order to do that they open up Internet Explorer to go the Firefox website and they go, “Hey, this isn’t as bad as I remember it was!”

凯文：所以您认为有人使用的是以前版本的Windows，例如，他们已经切换到Firefox，然后他们得到了全新的计算机，将其启动，并安装了Internet Explorer 8，并且去安装Firefox，然后打开IE浏览器去Firefox网站，他们说：“嘿，这还不如我记得！”

Brad: I mean it very well could be or maybe they just — they don’t know, they had Firefox, somebody installed it for them, and then they get a new computer or they upgrade and there’s Windows 8 and they don’t care, a browser’s a browser’s a browser, so they open it up and they start browsing. It would be cool if we could see, as far as the IE 8 number, if we could see the difference between that because that would really help understand what’s going on here.

布拉德：我的意思是，很有可能，或者只是他们-他们不知道，他们有Firefox，有人为他们安装了Firefox，然后他们换了新电脑，或者升级了，有了Windows 8，他们不在乎，浏览器是浏览器还是浏览器，因此他们打开了浏览器并开始浏览。如果我们能够看到IE 8的编号，那么如果能看到两者之间的差异，那将很酷，因为这确实有助于理解此处的情况。

Kevin: There’s an interesting story over at PC Pro. The title of the story is Microsoft man: “My job is to destroy IE6”. And then you read the story and that quote does not actually appear anywhere in the story; the actual quote in the story is from Ryan Gavin, head of the Internet Explorer Business Group, who says, “Part of my job is to get IE6 share down to zero as soon as possible,” not quite destroy IE6 there.

凯文：在PC Pro上有一个有趣的故事。故事的标题是微软人：“我的工作是销毁IE6” 。然后，您阅读了该故事，该报价实际上并没有出现在故事中的任何位置。故事中的实际报价来自Internet Explorer业务组负责人Ryan Gavin，他说：“我的部分工作是使IE6份额尽快降至零，”并没有完全破坏IE6。

Brad: Give that guy a raise!

布拉德：给那个家伙加薪！

Kevin: (laughs)

凯文：(笑)

Patrick: Microsoft Man, like a superhero or something. What was that about?

帕特里克：微软人，就像超级英雄之类的。那是关于什么的？

Kevin: (laughs) Reading that headline I pictured someone at Microsoft whose sole job he was paid day in and day out to get people off Internet Explorer 6 by any means necessary.

凯文：(笑)我读了这个标题，就给我看了一个微软公司的人，他每天唯一的工作就是用任何必要的手段让人们离开Internet Explorer 6。

Patrick: They should post a video of him on YouTube dressed as a superhero and then fighting a character that’s the IE6 logo and punching it and beating it up and kicking it on the ground.

帕特里克(Patrick)：他们应该以超级英雄的身份在YouTube上发布有关他的视频，然后与IE6徽标的角色搏斗并对其进行猛打并殴打并踢倒在地。

Kevin: (laughs) You’d have to be a bit of an outsider if that was your actual job at Microsoft. But, no, it doesn’t seem like there is anyone at Microsoft whose only job is to get people off Internet Explorer 6.

凯文：(笑)如果那是您在Microsoft的实际工作，那么您必须是个局外人。但是，不，微软似乎没有任何人唯一的工作就是让人们离开Internet Explorer 6。

Nevertheless, this story does link to an interesting ad campaign that Microsoft Australia ran recently; comparing using Internet Explorer 6 to drinking nine year old milk.

不过，这个故事确实与Microsoft澳大利亚最近开展的一个有趣的广告活动有关。比较使用Internet Explorer 6与喝9岁牛奶。

Stephan: (laughs)

斯蒂芬：(笑)

Patrick: Not quite apt.

帕特里克：不太合适。

Kevin: Looking at the ad it’s got this sort of carton, this milk carton on it that’s stamped “use by August 2001”, and the name of the brand of milk is “You wouldn’t drink nine year old milk,” and then the story says, “So why use a nine year old browser? When Internet Explorer 6 was launched in 2001 it offered cutting edge security for the time. Since then the Internet has evolved and the security features of Internet Explorer 6 have become outdated. With the latest state of the art security features, Internet Explorer 8 is designed to cope with today’s modern cyber crime; in fact, research studies prove it.” And then it goes on to cite research studies about how many malware attacks Internet Explorer 8 was able to block compared to its competitors.

凯文：在广告上看到有这种纸箱，上面印有“到2001年8月已使用”的牛奶纸箱，牛奶品牌的名字是“你不会喝9岁的牛奶”，然后故事说：“那为什么要使用9年的浏览器呢？当Internet Explorer 6在2001年推出时，它提供了当时最先进的安全性。从那时起，Internet不断发展，Internet Explorer 6的安全功能已过时。 Internet Explorer 8具有最新的最新安全功能，旨在应对当今的现代网络犯罪。实际上，研究证明了这一点。” 然后，它继续引用有关Internet Explorer 8与竞争对手相比能够阻止多少恶意软件攻击的研究报告。

And, yeah, I think you’re right, Patrick, this isn’t quite apt. Why don’t you think this makes sense?

而且，是的，我想您是对的，帕特里克，这不太恰当。您为什么不觉得这有意义？

Patrick: Because I’ll use IE6 any day before I drink nine year old milk. I would use IE6 right now if that was the choice. I’ll use it for as long as I need to not drink nine year old milk.

帕特里克：因为我会在喝9岁牛奶之前的任何一天使用IE6。如果可以的话，我现在就使用IE6。只要我不需要喝九岁的牛奶，我就会使用它。

Kevin: (laughs) Next time on Fear Factor.

凯文：(笑)下次是《恐惧因素》。

Patrick: It will become 20 year old milk before I stop using IE6.

帕特里克：在我停止使用IE6之前，它将变成20岁的牛奶。

Kevin: (laughs)

凯文：(笑)

Stephan: If the whole point of the thing is to say that IE8 can block malware, why don’t they just use some malware to update the people that are on IE6?

史蒂芬：如果要说IE8可以阻止恶意软件，为什么他们不只是使用某些恶意软件来更新IE6上的人员呢？

Kevin: Hey now.

凯文：嘿。

Stephan: A virus to upgrade?

斯蒂芬：要升级的病毒？

Patrick: I think this is fun and clever though. I do think it’s fun; I do think it’s clever. We’re talking about it, that’s the point.

帕特里克：我觉得这很有趣而且很聪明。我认为这很有趣；我认为这很聪明。我们正在谈论它，这就是重点。

Kevin: Yeah, it is very clever. The hole that I see in this is that the “use by August 2001”, are they saying that the Internet Explorer 6 browser was out of date in August 2001?

凯文：是的，非常聪明。我在此看到的漏洞是“到2001年8月使用”，他们是说Internet Explorer 6浏览器在2001年8月过时了吗？

Stephan: It came out and it was out of date.

史蒂芬：它出来了，已经过时了。

Kevin: (laughs)

凯文：(笑)

Brad: You know what’s interesting about this ad, and I think we had this on I want to say probably six months ago in an episode, there was another funny little ad like this that Microsoft put out, but they all seemed to be based in other countries and not the U.S.; I don’t know if I’ve seen an ad similar to this that’s this like blunt about it.

布拉德：您知道这则广告有什么有趣的地方，我想大概是六个月前的一集中，我想说的是，微软还发布了另一个有趣的小广告，但它们似乎都基于其他国家而不是美国；我不知道我是否看过类似的广告，对此感到生硬。

Patrick: People in the U.S. are cynical jerks, that’s why.

帕特里克(Patrick)：美国人民是愤世嫉俗的混蛋，这就是原因。

Brad: Maybe it is. The ads don’t seem as blunt. They certainly tell people to upgrade but they don’t seem as in your face as these type, and I guess maybe that’s just advertising in general.

布拉德：也许是。广告似乎并不那么钝。他们肯定会告诉人们进行升级，但是在您的面前他们看起来并不像这些类型，我想也许这只是一般的广告。

Patrick: Other countries have more fun. Or Australia has more fun let’s say. It seems like it’s always in Australia; Microsoft Australia does things — if they do something wrong they overstep their bounds or they do something funny.

帕特里克：其他国家/地区更有趣。或说澳大利亚有更多的乐趣。似乎总是在澳大利亚；微软澳大利亚公司做的事情-如果他们做错了事，他们就会越界或做些有趣的事。

Kevin: Do you guys remember when Microsoft New Zealand did the theme for Windows XP? There was this unique theme for Windows XP that you could only download from the Microsoft New Zealand website.

凯文：你们还记得微软新西兰公司为Windows XP做主题吗？ Windows XP有一个独特的主题，您只能从Microsoft New Zealand网站下载。

Patrick: I don’t remember that.

帕特里克：我不记得了。

Kevin: Well, I’ll be honest with you guys, I live in Australia and I had not seen this ad campaign until it came up in this story. So the impression I get is that while Microsoft USA is busy developing software, all of the international subsidiaries are sitting there going, well, what are we supposed to do? Oh, I guess we’ll do another ad campaign that no one will see.

凯文：恩，我对你们说老实话，我住在澳大利亚，直到这个故事出现之前，我都没有看过这个广告系列。因此，我得到的印象是，尽管Microsoft USA忙于开发软件，但所有国际子公司都坐在那里，我们应该怎么做？哦，我想我们会做另一个没人能看到的广告活动。

Stephan: It just sounds — it sounds like New Zealand and Australia have kind of gone rogue and they’re doing their own thing down there.

史蒂芬：听起来像—听起来新西兰和澳大利亚有点无赖，他们在那儿做自己的事。

Brad: Watch out.

布拉德：当心。

Kevin: (laughs) So you mentioned why don’t they just use a bit of malware to get those Internet Explorer 6 users to upgrade against their will.

凯文：(笑)所以您提到了为什么他们不只是使用一些恶意软件来使那些Internet Explorer 6用户违背自己的意愿进行升级。

Stephan: Yeah, it proves their point and it gets the software upgraded.

斯蒂芬：是的，这证明了他们的观点，并且对软件进行了升级。

Kevin: It looks like PC Pro asked our friend Ryan Gavin about that because they also quote him by saying — they say, “‘The momentum behind Windows 7 will drive a refresh cycle,’ he continued, adding that turning off support for Internet Explorer 6 in a bid to push customers towards later versions was “unacceptable.”’” So, there’s your answer, Stephan, I think Microsoft considers that unacceptable. But will Microsoft Australia consider it unacceptable, that’s the question. (laughs)

凯文： PC Pro似乎向我们的朋友瑞安·加文(Ryan Gavin)问了这个问题，因为他们也引用了他的话-他们说：“ Windows 7背后的动力将推动刷新周期，”他继续说道，并补充说，关闭了对Internet Explorer的支持。 6为了将客户推向更高版本是“不可接受的”。'“” Stephan，您的答案，我认为Microsoft认为这是不可接受的。但是微软澳大利亚会认为这是不可接受的，这就是问题所在。 (笑)

Stephan: So do they shudder to think that Chrome auto-upgrades people? Do they shudder when they see that like they’re shaking in their boots going, “Oh my gosh, I can’t believe they did that?”

史蒂芬(Stephan)：那么，他们是否会以为Chrome浏览器会自动升级？当他们看到靴子在颤抖时，他们会发抖：“哦，天哪，我不敢相信他们这样做了？”

Kevin: Yeah, exactly.

凯文：是的，确实如此。

Stephan: (laughs) I kind of like it. I don’t have to worry about it, you know, I mean.

斯蒂芬：(笑)我有点喜欢。我的意思是，我不必担心。

Kevin: Yeah. So, yeah, once again this comes back to the only real problem here being the fact that Microsoft didn’t release a new browser version for, what was it, five years. And so the use by date on that carton I would actually stick in 2006 some time because, yeah, the milk that they made in 2001 it seems like they expected it to last all that time. So the fact that we’re now in 2010 I guess it only means that the milk is — it’s twice its lifetime than it should have been. So, you know, if your average carton of milk lasts a week, we’re two weeks in at the moment. And that’s one of the very good points made in the comment thread on that story.

凯文：是的。所以，是的，这又回到了唯一的真正问题，那就是微软五年来一直没有发布新的浏览器版本。因此，按日期使用该纸箱实际上我会在2006年停留一段时间，是的，是的，他们在2001年生产的牛奶似乎希望它们能一直使用下去。因此，我们现在才是2010年这一事实，我想它仅仅是意味着，牛奶的使用寿命是原来的两倍。因此，您知道，如果您的平均一箱牛奶能持续一周，那么我们现在已经两周了。这是该故事的评论主题中提出的非常好的观点之一。

Stephan: Or they just don’t care if you drink, you know, old milk.

斯蒂芬：或者他们只是不在乎你是否喝旧牛奶。

Patrick: I might drink two week old milk rather than use IE6.

帕特里克：我可能会喝两周大的牛奶，而不要使用IE6。

Kevin: Yeah? (laughs)

凯文：是吗？ (笑)

Patrick: There’s a big difference between two weeks and nine years, so yeah.

帕特里克：两个星期和九年之间有很大的差异，是的。

Kevin: I think I might too. It just gets a bit creamier, right?

凯文：我想我也可能。只是有点奶油，对吗？

Brad: When is the next live stream of the podcast? We need to get some video on.

布拉德：播客的下一个直播时间是什么时候？我们需要播放一些视频。

Kevin: (laughs) Browser news number three! And this is our last big piece of browser news for the past couple of weeks is Safari 5 has been released. So we’ve got new versions of Chrome, new versions of Safari and people are still trying to get people on to the new version of Internet Explorer. But Safari 5 is out for both Mac and Windows, and this was released in conjunction with the first day of Apple’s WWDC, Worldwide Developer Conference, that is going on as we record this. And whereas the previous version, Safari 4, seemed to be very much a user focused release, they revamped the user interface, made this slick 3D looking new home page; this release, Safari 5, has got a lot of stuff for developers in it. I have to admit when I first fired it up I did not see much new from the user standpoint. Stephan have you got this new version installed?

凯文：(笑)浏览器新闻三号！这是Safari在过去几周内发布的最后一个重要新闻。因此，我们有了新版本的Chrome，新版本的Safari，并且人们仍在尝试使人们使用Internet Explorer的新版本。但是Safari 5在Mac和Windows上都可以使用，并且是在苹果公司WWDC全球开发者大会的第一天发布的，我们正在记录。虽然以前的版本Safari 4似乎是一个以用户为中心的发行版，但他们改进了用户界面，使这个光滑的3D外观看起来像新的主页；这个版本的Safari 5为开发人员提供了很多东西。我不得不承认，当我第一次启动它时，从用户的角度来看，我没有看到太多新东西。史蒂芬(Stephan)是否已安装此新版本？

Stephan: I actually have it installed on my Windows computer at work but not on my Mac yet because I had to reboot to install it, so.

史蒂芬：我实际上是在工作时将其安装在Windows计算机上，但尚未在Mac上安装，因为我必须重新启动才能安装它。

Patrick: That sounds wrong.

帕特里克：听起来错了。

Stephan: Yeah, it sounds backwards, doesn’t it?

斯蒂芬：是的，听起来倒是，不是吗？

Kevin: Yeah.

凯文：是的。

Stephan: But it’s not. It’s really cool to have the extensions now is the big thing for developers, so you can develop extensions using HTML5, CSS3, and JavaScript and do some cool things, and there’s some extensions out there that are neat. Panic has one that allows you to basically take notes on a page and then email those notes with a screenshot of the page immediately off to someone else. So I thought that was pretty cool. And we’ll get more into the extensions later. Hint, hint, nudge, nudge.

史蒂芬：但是不是。现在拥有扩展对于开发人员来说真的很酷，因此您可以使用HTML5，CSS3和JavaScript开发扩展并做一些有趣的事情，并且那里有一些简洁的扩展。 Panic可以让您基本上在页面上做笔记，然后通过电子邮件将这些笔记和页面截图立即发送给其他人。所以我认为那很酷。稍后我们将进一步扩展。提示，暗示，微调，微调。

Kevin: (laughs) But the one — the biggest user-facing feature that I can see in this new version is the new Safari Reader feature. If it detects that you’re looking at a page that has an article on it, even if it’s just the first page of that article, so if the article’s split over multiple pages, it will pop up a button in the address bar that says reader, and when you click on that it strips away, well, first of all, the current page fades into the background and it brings up a view that is just this stripped back content only view of the article. So the navigation bars are gone, the ads are gone, and all you see is the content, and it even goes ahead and auto downloads the subsequent pages of the article and tacks them onto the bottom of this stripped down view. It is from a user’s standpoint I’d say it is a really impressive feature if it works on the sites that you visit. I have to say its record on detecting sites with articles in them is a little spotty; I couldn’t get it, for example, to detect articles on sitepoint.com or on several other sites that I visit. But the New York Times apparently worked for you Stephan?

凯文：(笑)但是，在新版本中可以看到的最大的面向用户的功能是新的Safari阅读器功能。如果它检测到您正在查看的页面上有文章，即使它只是该文章的第一页，那么如果该文章分为多个页面，它将在地址栏中弹出一个按钮，显示阅读器，当您单击它时，它会被剥离，首先，当前页面淡入背景，并且会弹出一个视图，该视图就是本文的仅剥离内容的视图。因此，导航栏消失了，广告消失了，您所看到的只是内容，它甚至继续前进，并自动下载了文章的后续页面，并将其添加到此简化视图的底部。从用户的角度来看，如果它可以在您访问的网站上运行，那么我会说这是一个非常令人印象深刻的功能。我不得不说，它在检测包含文章的站点时的记录有点不完整；例如，我无法检测到sitepoint.com或我访问的其他几个站点上的文章。但是《纽约时报》显然为您服务吗？

Stephan: Yep, yep, it’ll pull up the full article if it’s paged and show you the article, and it’s slick, slick interface.

史蒂芬：是的，是的，它将分页显示整篇文章，并向您展示该文章，而且它的界面精巧，光滑。

Brad: Advertisers are going to love this.

布拉德：广告客户会喜欢这个。

Patrick: Yeah, the next feature Safari’s launching in Safari 6 is the ability to make sure content writers make no money ever in the history of time. That will be the next act to make sure they can’t make any money at all. No, I don’t know, I mean how far away is this from like default ad blocking?

帕特里克(Patrick)：是的，Safari在Safari 6中推出的下一个功能是确保内容编写者在时间上不会赚钱的功能。这将是确保他们根本无法赚钱的下一个行为。不，我不知道，我的意思是说这与默认广告拦截有多远？

Stephan: What I was going to say was that there’s already stuff that already does this, like Instapaper and Read It Later, where you never even look at the article, it just clicks a button and it goes to this thing and it’s just the text of the article.

史蒂芬：我要说的是，已经有一些东西可以做到这一点，例如Instapaper和Read It Later，您甚至都没有看过这篇文章，只需单击一个按钮，然后转到该东西，这就是文本的文章。

Patrick: So I don’t know every web service in the world, thanks Stephan! I’m just kidding, no.

帕特里克(Patrick)：所以我不知道世界上所有的Web服务，谢谢斯蒂芬(Stephan)！我只是在开玩笑，不。

Stephan: No, but I’m just saying things like this already exist on — an example is on Twitter half the time I don’t click on people’s links to stories and stuff, I just send it to Instapaper and I read it later. And so I don’t look at any of the ads or anything, I just read the article.

斯蒂芬：不，但是我只是说这样的事情已经存在了，在Twitter上的一个例子是，有一半时间我没有点击人们对故事和内容的链接，而是将其发送给Instapaper，稍后再阅读。因此，我没有看任何广告或任何内容，我只看了这篇文章。

Patrick: Yeah, for me there’s a question of separation between browser and add-on let’s say, or browser and service, like obviously everyone knows if you want to know Firefox has an ad blocking plug-in that is very popular, multiple ones. But it’s not default, right, and there’s sort of a separation there between those two maybe thoughts and how they go about doing that. I don’t know, the reader feature seems okay, but it just seems really weird for me to see it, I mean what’s the limit like if it goes to forum posts, if it identifies any large body of text, let’s say; can it automatically separate that from any site, add all the pages together even if it’s a 10,000 word article that’s broken up over ten pages that took a hundred hours to write and thousands of dollars in resources, tens of thousands of dollars of resources from the publication, and does it eliminate the ad? I see that it fades, so they still do visit the page, maybe they don’t visit all the pages, —

帕特里克(Patrick)：是的，对我来说，浏览器与插件或浏览器与服务之间存在分离的问题，就像每个人都知道您是否想知道Firefox具有一个非常流行的广告拦截插件一样。 But it's not default, right, and there's sort of a separation there between those two maybe thoughts and how they go about doing that. I don't know, the reader feature seems okay, but it just seems really weird for me to see it, I mean what's the limit like if it goes to forum posts, if it identifies any large body of text, let's say; can it automatically separate that from any site, add all the pages together even if it's a 10,000 word article that's broken up over ten pages that took a hundred hours to write and thousands of dollars in resources, tens of thousands of dollars of resources from the publication, and does it eliminate the ad? I see that it fades, so they still do visit the page, maybe they don't visit all the pages, —

Kevin: They do.

Patrick: — but it looks like they still have to visit the page. No, but I mean the ads for a page like clicking ten pages in a row, let’s say.

Patrick: — but it looks like they still have to visit the page. No, but I mean the ads for a page like clicking ten pages in a row, let's say.

Kevin: Yeah, yeah. Reading the specification, what the browser does in the background is it does full page requests for all of those other pages. So it does register ad impressions, but the user will never see those ads.

凯文：是的，是的。 Reading the specification, what the browser does in the background is it does full page requests for all of those other pages. So it does register ad impressions, but the user will never see those ads.

Patrick: See, that’s screwing with the system. I mean that’s really messing with how all this is supposed to work. And part of it, I mean Apple, we talked about this before, and how much they really care about, you know, everyone else, let’s say. But, I don’t’ know, you know, it’s such a weird thing for the new inflated ad numbers but never show those ads for the sake of user freedom? And of course most of the people in the world are users, they’re not writers. So of course most people would say, oh, great feature, I love this! But then there’s a small percentage of us that try to make a living writing content and putting it online, and this just makes it that much harder. Should Apple care? I don’t know, whatever, but it still gives me pause.

Patrick: See, that's screwing with the system. I mean that's really messing with how all this is supposed to work. And part of it, I mean Apple, we talked about this before, and how much they really care about, you know, everyone else, let's say. But, I don't' know, you know, it's such a weird thing for the new inflated ad numbers but never show those ads for the sake of user freedom? And of course most of the people in the world are users, they're not writers. So of course most people would say, oh, great feature, I love this! But then there's a small percentage of us that try to make a living writing content and putting it online, and this just makes it that much harder. Should Apple care? I don't know, whatever, but it still gives me pause.

Stephan: But it’s also that you still have to go to one page, like you still have to go to at least the front page of an article. I’m not saying it’s the right thing to do, Patrick, but what I’m saying is that you still have to visit the page to use the reader. I’m not going to go around personally and start clicking on this thing every news site I come upon because it’s going to be a pain because I can’t — to go browse somewhere else I gotta click out of the reader again. So they’ve built it so that you can’t just browse the Internet through the reader and strip out the ads.

Stephan: But it's also that you still have to go to one page, like you still have to go to at least the front page of an article. I'm not saying it's the right thing to do, Patrick, but what I'm saying is that you still have to visit the page to use the reader. I'm not going to go around personally and start clicking on this thing every news site I come upon because it's going to be a pain because I can't — to go browse somewhere else I gotta click out of the reader again. So they've built it so that you can't just browse the Internet through the reader and strip out the ads.

Patrick: Yeah, that’s true. It is a weird thing; it could be a gateway.

Patrick: Yeah, that's true. It is a weird thing; it could be a gateway.

Brad: Now the mad dash is on to come up with a JavaScript that will automatically break out of this reader but detects it, you know.

Patrick: Yeah, I mean I won’t be shocked if that happened just like it happens with top bars or framed pages like the DiggBar, people will make that sort of thing —

Patrick: Yeah, I mean I won't be shocked if that happened just like it happens with top bars or framed pages like the DiggBar, people will make that sort of thing —

Brad: There’s a market. Make it a little app or an add-on for five bucks a pop to drop it on your website, breaks you out of this.

Brad: There's a market. Make it a little app or an add-on for five bucks a pop to drop it on your website, breaks you out of this.

Kevin: Sounds like a WordPress plug-in Brad.

All: (laugh)

Kevin: To be clear, the links in the story still do work, so if you’re reading a story and you see a link that you want to follow you click it and the reader view goes away and then it follows that link. So it’s not completely breaking your ability to browse from that story. But, yeah, you’re right, I kind of feel the same way as you, Patrick, there’s kind of a division of church and state between what is possible with add-ons and what is provided by default with browsers. I mean Apple has repeatedly in the past few months shown that they understand the value of advertising to subsidize free content. They are investing in this whole new ad platform for their apps on iPhones and iPads to be released later this month. I think the new iAd platform goes live July 1st, they’ve just announced. And their primary reason for doing that they say is so that people who are making free and inexpensive apps for their devices can get paid and can make money. And that’s what they’re doing with one hand, and with the other they are possibly contributing to the destruction of the ad landscape on the Web.

Kevin: To be clear, the links in the story still do work, so if you're reading a story and you see a link that you want to follow you click it and the reader view goes away and then it follows that link. So it's not completely breaking your ability to browse from that story. But, yeah, you're right, I kind of feel the same way as you, Patrick, there's kind of a division of church and state between what is possible with add-ons and what is provided by default with browsers. I mean Apple has repeatedly in the past few months shown that they understand the value of advertising to subsidize free content. They are investing in this whole new ad platform for their apps on iPhones and iPads to be released later this month. I think the new iAd platform goes live July 1st, they've just announced. And their primary reason for doing that they say is so that people who are making free and inexpensive apps for their devices can get paid and can make money. And that's what they're doing with one hand, and with the other they are possibly contributing to the destruction of the ad landscape on the Web.

Stephan: Hey, but to make up for it though they added Bing search, so.

Kevin: (laughs) Yes.

Patrick: Yeah, and you can now use the HTML5 tag <ruby>. Whoo, hoo!

Patrick: Yeah, and you can now use the HTML5 tag <ruby> . Whoo, hoo!

Stephan: Yes, yes.

Kevin: (laughs) But, you know, controversy aside, I have to applaud them for trying something new because every time a new browser comes out like this, especially a niche browser like Safari, they are really upfront about the fact that they understand that Safari is a small player in the browser market and that they don’t lead the pack. Certainly they have a really great technology platform, and the fact that the Webkit rendering engine that’s at the heart of Safari basically powers mobile web browsers, every single mobile web browser of note out there, means that the technology platform is really great. But as a desktop browser Safari is way behind the pack. So it would be tempting for them to just sort of sit back and just, you know, copycat other people’s features as required. But trying something brand new here with this reader feature I have to give them credit for that, and I would not be surprised to see this feature copied in other browsers because it is such a great feature for users. But, yeah, web advertisers are going to have to adapt; certainly the value for those ad impressions for subsequent pages of multipage articles has just dropped a great deal if users embrace this feature. You may not be seeing ads on page twos and threes anymore just because people won’t be seeing them if this feature catches on.

Kevin: (laughs) But, you know, controversy aside, I have to applaud them for trying something new because every time a new browser comes out like this, especially a niche browser like Safari, they are really upfront about the fact that they understand that Safari is a small player in the browser market and that they don't lead the pack. Certainly they have a really great technology platform, and the fact that the Webkit rendering engine that's at the heart of Safari basically powers mobile web browsers, every single mobile web browser of note out there, means that the technology platform is really great. But as a desktop browser Safari is way behind the pack. So it would be tempting for them to just sort of sit back and just, you know, copycat other people's features as required. But trying something brand new here with this reader feature I have to give them credit for that, and I would not be surprised to see this feature copied in other browsers because it is such a great feature for users. But, yeah, web advertisers are going to have to adapt; certainly the value for those ad impressions for subsequent pages of multipage articles has just dropped a great deal if users embrace this feature. You may not be seeing ads on page twos and threes anymore just because people won't be seeing them if this feature catches on.

Stephan: I’d like to see — I guess I need to try this out and see how it works with those ads that are embedded in links, you know where you hover over the links and it pops up like a little window or something. I want to — I should see how that handles —

Stephan: I'd like to see — I guess I need to try this out and see how it works with those ads that are embedded in links, you know where you hover over the links and it pops up like a little window or something. I want to — I should see how that handles —

Patrick: I’m sure it strips JavaScript right out.

Patrick: I'm sure it strips JavaScript right out.

Kevin: Looking at — because I’m looking at the article about this new browser release on Ars Technica, and the reader feature detects the article on Ars Technica, and the article itself at the very top of the article has one of these right floated feature images, sort of the image that represents the article, and that is stripped out by the reader.

Kevin: Looking at — because I'm looking at the article about this new browser release on Ars Technica, and the reader feature detects the article on Ars Technica, and the article itself at the very top of the article has one of these right floated feature images, sort of the image that represents the article, and that is stripped out by the reader.

Patrick: Well, you know, one day if this is popular down the road we can all sign up for Apple’s ad platform that will have ads on these reader pages so that we can all participate in their platform.

Patrick: Well, you know, one day if this is popular down the road we can all sign up for Apple's ad platform that will have ads on these reader pages so that we can all participate in their platform.

Kevin: (laughs) There you go, you found the endgame. Apple will be serving their own ads soon enough.

Alright. But that isn’t the only controversy around Safari 5, and there’s this other controversy to do with how Apple is promoting its new HTML5 standard support. In addition to releasing the browser they’ve also released this new page on the Apple website, it’s the HTML5 showcase showing off features of HTML5, once again this is in the broadest definition of HTML5 that you can think of, but features that are supported by the new Safari browser. And when this first came out it seemed like they were going– and to some extent they are, they’re saying, look, this is what you can do with web standards, you don’t need Flash to do this stuff. Is that the message you guys got from this?

好的。 But that isn't the only controversy around Safari 5, and there's this other controversy to do with how Apple is promoting its new HTML5 standard support. In addition to releasing the browser they've also released this new page on the Apple website, it's the HTML5 showcase showing off features of HTML5, once again this is in the broadest definition of HTML5 that you can think of, but features that are supported by the new Safari browser. And when this first came out it seemed like they were going– and to some extent they are, they're saying, look, this is what you can do with web standards, you don't need Flash to do this stuff. Is that the message you guys got from this?

Brad: Yeah, I mean I think that’s overall the point of it is just to show, because obviously Apple is not going to use Flash on the iPhone and iPad devices, and so now they’re kind of trying to back it up with some demos to say look what we can do, look what we’re striving to use HTML5 which should ultimately they would love to replace Flash.

Brad: Yeah, I mean I think that's overall the point of it is just to show, because obviously Apple is not going to use Flash on the iPhone and iPad devices, and so now they're kind of trying to back it up with some demos to say look what we can do, look what we're striving to use HTML5 which should ultimately they would love to replace Flash.

Kevin: Yeah. So if you go to apple.com/html5, that’s the address of this showcase, but if you go there in any browser except Safari then when you click on one of those examples it will say sorry you need Safari to view these examples. And on a page where the title is HTML5 and web standards, this seems like — this seems really counter to the message they’re trying to get out there that the benefit of web standards is that you develop it using these standards and it works everywhere, but sorry, you actually need Safari to see these demos. This is what’s got web developers all over the Web in outcry. You know, gotta give credit to Apple for getting the message of web standards out there, but this is not the way to do it I have to say. It’s a fine line, I mean obviously they did this to promote their new browser release, and so if people were coming here using Chrome and going, oh yeah, HTML5 is pretty cool, I am happy with my browser choice, you know, Apple wouldn’t be getting much bang for its marketing buck here. But if they’re — they’re trying to serve two masters here; they’re trying to promote web standards and they’re also trying to promote their browser. I think they need to pick one.

凯文：是的。 So if you go to apple.com/html5 , that's the address of this showcase, but if you go there in any browser except Safari then when you click on one of those examples it will say sorry you need Safari to view these examples. And on a page where the title is HTML5 and web standards, this seems like — this seems really counter to the message they're trying to get out there that the benefit of web standards is that you develop it using these standards and it works everywhere, but sorry, you actually need Safari to see these demos. This is what's got web developers all over the Web in outcry. You know, gotta give credit to Apple for getting the message of web standards out there, but this is not the way to do it I have to say. It's a fine line, I mean obviously they did this to promote their new browser release, and so if people were coming here using Chrome and going, oh yeah, HTML5 is pretty cool, I am happy with my browser choice, you know, Apple wouldn't be getting much bang for its marketing buck here. But if they're — they're trying to serve two masters here; they're trying to promote web standards and they're also trying to promote their browser. I think they need to pick one.

Brad: What was it during the Flash controversy where Steve Jobs said that he supports the open web and HTML5 and I mean, like you said, this is not the open web, this is Apple pushing Safari on you and trying to make people download it. I think it’s in bad taste to be honest.

Patrick: On one hand, you know what I thought of when I saw this, and I don’t know what country it was, it might’ve been Microsoft Australia, but it was some country other than the U.S.

Patrick: On one hand, you know what I thought of when I saw this, and I don't know what country it was, it might've been Microsoft Australia, but it was some country other than the US

Kevin: (laughs)

凯文：(笑)

Patrick: And I’m dead serious when I say that. I think it was Microsoft Australia, but I don’t know, where they had — it was to promote IE 7 or 8, to get people to download it or something like that, and it was —

Patrick: And I'm dead serious when I say that. I think it was Microsoft Australia, but I don't know, where they had — it was to promote IE 7 or 8, to get people to download it or something like that, and it was —

Kevin: I think you’re right actually.

Kevin: I think you're right actually.

Patrick: — and it was giving away cash. It wasn’t promoting web standards. And there was an outcry because they made people use the browser or at least the user string, and so, you know, there was an outcry and they relented allowing people from all browsers to view and win the cash. Now on one hand I didn’t have a problem with that because Microsoft was promoting their browser. So I feel a similar way here except that Apple isn’t giving away cash, they’re talking about web standards and how open everything is. And it does seem counterintuitive to say, okay, you have to view it in this. And it is kind of weird and I don’t know why they felt it was necessary to do that, I mean they had to make a conscious decision, right, to actually do this. So that’s why it strikes me as strange.

Patrick: — and it was giving away cash. It wasn't promoting web standards. And there was an outcry because they made people use the browser or at least the user string, and so, you know, there was an outcry and they relented allowing people from all browsers to view and win the cash. Now on one hand I didn't have a problem with that because Microsoft was promoting their browser. So I feel a similar way here except that Apple isn't giving away cash, they're talking about web standards and how open everything is. And it does seem counterintuitive to say, okay, you have to view it in this. And it is kind of weird and I don't know why they felt it was necessary to do that, I mean they had to make a conscious decision, right, to actually do this. So that's why it strikes me as strange.

Stephan: You’re open. You’re open to use Safari to view those things that’s…

Stephan: You're open. You're open to use Safari to view those things that's…

All: (laugh)

Kevin: If you go to the bottom of the page there’s a link for developers, which takes you to the Safari Developer Center, which has another way to get at all of these exact same demos; it takes you to developer.apple.com/safaridemos, and it’s the exact same list of demos but this time they’ll let any browser in. So it really is they just took this group of demos they already had and put a new Safari-only wrapper around them on purpose.

Kevin: If you go to the bottom of the page there's a link for developers, which takes you to the Safari Developer Center, which has another way to get at all of these exact same demos; it takes you to developer.apple.com/safaridemos , and it's the exact same list of demos but this time they'll let any browser in. So it really is they just took this group of demos they already had and put a new Safari-only wrapper around them on purpose.

Patrick: Does it not support Firefox, the latest version of Firefox?

Kevin: It depends on the demo.

Patrick: Okay, because I’m 0 for 3 so far.

Patrick: Okay, because I'm 0 for 3 so far.

Stephan: If there’s anything 3D in it, it probably won’t work.

Stephan: If there's anything 3D in it, it probably won't work.

Kevin: Yeah, exactly. So I’ve heard that like two out of the eight demos work well in Safari, for example, uh, work well in Firefox.

凯文：是的，确实如此。 So I've heard that like two out of the eight demos work well in Safari, for example, uh, work well in Firefox.

Patrick: So far I’m on zero; I’m on 0 for 6, so let’s see.

Patrick: So far I'm on zero; I'm on 0 for 6, so let's see.

Kevin: But yeah, they need to do this page that says here’s the demos, click through them and see how they work in your browser, and here’s the compatibility table that shows you what you can expect. And it should show Safari supports all of them whereas Chrome supports most of them and Firefox supports some of them; that’s how you promote your browser. You don’t put up a “You must have Safari to view these web standards examples.”

Kevin: But yeah, they need to do this page that says here's the demos, click through them and see how they work in your browser, and here's the compatibility table that shows you what you can expect. And it should show Safari supports all of them whereas Chrome supports most of them and Firefox supports some of them; that's how you promote your browser. You don't put up a “You must have Safari to view these web standards examples.”

Patrick: Literally none of the demos work for me. I’m just saying. It’s Firefox 3.6.3, I’m on the page, opened each demo, it’s actually more than eight, I think it’s around 13 if you go to a second page; not a single one works, I don’t know, but there you go.

Patrick: Literally none of the demos work for me. I'm just saying. It's Firefox 3.6.3, I'm on the page, opened each demo, it's actually more than eight, I think it's around 13 if you go to a second page; not a single one works, I don't know, but there you go.

Kevin: SitePoint author Cameron Adams pointed out on Twitter that these demos really are kind of demo-ware, you certainly wouldn’t be well advised to copy the code in these demos and use them on your own site. He points out, for example, that the blur effect in the gallery demo is done by having separate blurred image files rather than doing some clever JavaScript with the canvas tag to create a blurred effect. So they cut a lot of corners to get these demos done. They really are to show what the rendering engine can do, not the best way of doing these sorts of things.

Kevin: SitePoint author Cameron Adams pointed out on Twitter that these demos really are kind of demo-ware, you certainly wouldn't be well advised to copy the code in these demos and use them on your own site. He points out, for example, that the blur effect in the gallery demo is done by having separate blurred image files rather than doing some clever JavaScript with the canvas tag to create a blurred effect. So they cut a lot of corners to get these demos done. They really are to show what the rendering engine can do, not the best way of doing these sorts of things.

So enough said about Safari, I think, and that brings our massive browser news countdown for this week to an end. We do have a few other stories, though, to look at. Stephan this is something you pointed out a couple of weeks ago, and I wanted to come back to it because I think it really is an interesting story, and the blog post is called What I Wish a Ruby Programmer Had Told Me One Year Ago. Why did this catch your eye?

Stephan: I don’t know, because I’ve kind of been out of development for a while, you know, pure development where that’s all I’m doing, so I was just reading this article and it was like this is kind of me, but I haven’t picked up Ruby or Python, you know, I know Python, but I haven’t picked up Ruby. And so I was just reading through this and it kind of struck me that he’s talking about how these languages, or how Ruby’s so beautiful that it’s evil.

Stephan: I don't know, because I've kind of been out of development for a while, you know, pure development where that's all I'm doing, so I was just reading this article and it was like this is kind of me, but I haven't picked up Ruby or Python, you know, I know Python, but I haven't picked up Ruby. And so I was just reading through this and it kind of struck me that he's talking about how these languages, or how Ruby's so beautiful that it's evil.

Kevin: (laughs) It’s insidious.

Kevin: (laughs) It's insidious.

Stephan: It’s insidious, you know, it just gets under your skin. So it’s kind of like it’s one of those things that if you’re not a developer or you were a developer at one point and you want to get back into it I think it’s just a really cool look at the language itself, and one guy’s outside look at getting into Ruby development.

Stephan: It's insidious, you know, it just gets under your skin. So it's kind of like it's one of those things that if you're not a developer or you were a developer at one point and you want to get back into it I think it's just a really cool look at the language itself, and one guy's outside look at getting into Ruby development.

Kevin: When I read this article I was afraid that it was going to be another one of those, you know, I tried PHP and it sucked, and I tried Python and it kind of sucked, and then I finally tried Ruby and it was the second coming of languages and it changed my life, and if you’re not using Ruby you’re crazy. And it wasn’t one of those. The message that I took away from this article was really just that if you, as a professional web developer, allow yourself to fall into a comfort zone of using any one language to the exclusion of all others, then you’re doing yourself a disservice.

Kevin: When I read this article I was afraid that it was going to be another one of those, you know, I tried PHP and it sucked, and I tried Python and it kind of sucked, and then I finally tried Ruby and it was the second coming of languages and it changed my life, and if you're not using Ruby you're crazy. And it wasn't one of those. The message that I took away from this article was really just that if you, as a professional web developer, allow yourself to fall into a comfort zone of using any one language to the exclusion of all others, then you're doing yourself a disservice.

He comes away by saying PHP is not a bad language, but once I looked at Ruby I decided that for most things I prefer Ruby, PHP is just not the language for me. And that as a professional web developer you should allow yourself to be exposed to those other options so that when a better tool comes along for a particular job you’re aware of it rather than continuing working with whatever you’re used to. And I think that’s a valuable message.

He comes away by saying PHP is not a bad language, but once I looked at Ruby I decided that for most things I prefer Ruby, PHP is just not the language for me. And that as a professional web developer you should allow yourself to be exposed to those other options so that when a better tool comes along for a particular job you're aware of it rather than continuing working with whatever you're used to. And I think that's a valuable message.

Stephan: Yeah, I agree. I think it’s like don’t get stuck in a rut of one language and just that’s all you know. Because, you know, one day PHP may stop being developed on, you know, something like that, and you’re gonna be like, well, I don’t know anything else and so do I go work at Burger King? You know, I think it’s always good to keep your mind going with something new. So it’s a good article to people who were worried about that, so.

Stephan: Yeah, I agree. I think it's like don't get stuck in a rut of one language and just that's all you know. Because, you know, one day PHP may stop being developed on, you know, something like that, and you're gonna be like, well, I don't know anything else and so do I go work at Burger King? You know, I think it's always good to keep your mind going with something new. So it's a good article to people who were worried about that, so.

Kevin: Yeah. So this particular article it turns out that for a certain class of developers who think and breathe code and who love elegant code, Ruby is a great language. But for other people for whom they’re just learning their very first programming language or programming is just something else they do on top of design, for example, languages like PHP are a lot more straightforward and easier to understand and make sense of, and for those people they’d want to choose PHP a lot of the time. But in every case the more options you can expose yourself to the better.

凯文：是的。 So this particular article it turns out that for a certain class of developers who think and breathe code and who love elegant code, Ruby is a great language. But for other people for whom they're just learning their very first programming language or programming is just something else they do on top of design, for example, languages like PHP are a lot more straightforward and easier to understand and make sense of, and for those people they'd want to choose PHP a lot of the time. But in every case the more options you can expose yourself to the better.

Speaking of options, we were talking about Apple’s campaign to raise standards up as a better choice than Flash, and as a result they aren’t supporting Flash on their mobile devices like the iPhone and iPad, well, one advertising firm is taking this as an opportunity to build something really exciting. This tool, or I guess you could call it a tool, it’s called Smokescreen and what it is, is a browser based compiler for Flash that converts any Flash movie or a certain subset of Flash movies at the moment, to be fair, from Flash into HTML5 and JavaScript. And I mentioned that they were an advertising campaign because the company that is building this thing their objective is to make it so that you can see those Flash ad banners in a browser that doesn’t support Flash.

Speaking of options, we were talking about Apple's campaign to raise standards up as a better choice than Flash, and as a result they aren't supporting Flash on their mobile devices like the iPhone and iPad, well, one advertising firm is taking this as an opportunity to build something really exciting. This tool, or I guess you could call it a tool, it's called Smokescreen and what it is, is a browser based compiler for Flash that converts any Flash movie or a certain subset of Flash movies at the moment, to be fair, from Flash into HTML5 and JavaScript. And I mentioned that they were an advertising campaign because the company that is building this thing their objective is to make it so that you can see those Flash ad banners in a browser that doesn't support Flash.

Patrick: This is pretty cool. I viewed a couple of the links, checked out the video, Strongbad email, I don’t know if they’re embedding that, if they should be embedding that or not, but as an aside it was cool to see how smooth it was without Flash and it’s interesting to think of maybe Apple as ‘the man’ and now they’re sticking it to the man, I don’t know.

Patrick: This is pretty cool. I viewed a couple of the links, checked out the video, Strongbad email, I don't know if they're embedding that, if they should be embedding that or not, but as an aside it was cool to see how smooth it was without Flash and it's interesting to think of maybe Apple as 'the man' and now they're sticking it to the man, I don't know.

Kevin: (laughs) Well, it’s weird to hear an ad firm sticking it to the man.

Kevin: (laughs) Well, it's weird to hear an ad firm sticking it to the man.

Patrick: That’s what Apple’s done to us.

Patrick: That's what Apple's done to us.

Kevin: (laughs)

凯文：(笑)

Stephan: Up is down, down is up.

Kevin: Yeah, so I guess the next step is for them to develop a library that makes Safari’s reader feature only display the ads on the page.

Kevin: Yeah, so I guess the next step is for them to develop a library that makes Safari's reader feature only display the ads on the page.

Patrick: Adobe should do this. Adobe should buy them right now.

Kevin: Adobe should buy this. This is incredible. Like when I read about it I thought, oh okay, here we go, you know, you keep hearing things about here’s the latest Super Nintendo emulator written in JavaScript and it runs at one frame per second, it just barely works on a small collection of demos. This thing works surprisingly well, like all of these examples, even the ones with, you know, like, audio tracks, they are surprisingly watchable. And Simon Willison, who once upon a time wrote the JavaScript blog for SitePoint, he’s well known in his work on projects like Django, for example, he looked under the hood and in this blog post wrote about what he found inside of this Smokescreen demo. He says “It’s an incredible piece of work. It runs entirely in the browser, reads in SWF binaries,” which are Flash movies, “unzips them in native JavaScript”; so that by itself is incredibly impressive to me the fact that he is unzipping binary files using JavaScript code. “Then it extracts the images and embedded audio and turns them into Base-64 encoded data URLs,” stop me if I’ve lost you; “then stitches the vector graphics back together as animated SVG.”

Kevin: Adobe should buy this. This is incredible. Like when I read about it I thought, oh okay, here we go, you know, you keep hearing things about here's the latest Super Nintendo emulator written in JavaScript and it runs at one frame per second, it just barely works on a small collection of demos. This thing works surprisingly well, like all of these examples, even the ones with, you know, like, audio tracks, they are surprisingly watchable. And Simon Willison, who once upon a time wrote the JavaScript blog for SitePoint, he's well known in his work on projects like Django, for example, he looked under the hood and in this blog post wrote about what he found inside of this Smokescreen demo. He says “It's an incredible piece of work. It runs entirely in the browser, reads in SWF binaries,” which are Flash movies, “unzips them in native JavaScript”; so that by itself is incredibly impressive to me the fact that he is unzipping binary files using JavaScript code. “Then it extracts the images and embedded audio and turns them into Base-64 encoded data URLs,” stop me if I've lost you; “then stitches the vector graphics back together as animated SVG.”

That’s incredible. (laughs) Every single step in that is worthy of a massive open source project, and yet they’ve managed to do it all. They really, really want their ads to work on the iPad.

这是令人难以置信的。 (laughs) Every single step in that is worthy of a massive open source project, and yet they've managed to do it all. They really, really want their ads to work on the iPad.

Patrick: Who is the ad firm?

Kevin: The ad firm is —

Patrick: I see at the bottom it’s copyright RevShock, that’s why I wasn’t sure.

Patrick: I see at the bottom it's copyright RevShock, that's why I wasn't sure.

Kevin: Yeah. Yeah, that’s them, RevShock.

凯文：是的。 Yeah, that's them, RevShock.

Brad: I mean if you’re the first ad agency that comes out and can promote this as a service I mean imagine the new business that they’re going to get from this alone. I mean so this would really put them at the top tier of their competitors.

Brad: I mean if you're the first ad agency that comes out and can promote this as a service I mean imagine the new business that they're going to get from this alone. I mean so this would really put them at the top tier of their competitors.

Patrick: Their Twitter page is apparently is @RevShockads, they have 251 followers, so that makes this even more amazing that they’re that small and coming up with this. But if they can pull it off then they could have a lot of people eating out of their hand perhaps.

Patrick: Their Twitter page is apparently is @RevShockads, they have 251 followers, so that makes this even more amazing that they're that small and coming up with this. But if they can pull it off then they could have a lot of people eating out of their hand perhaps.

Stephan: I’d like to see Steve Jobs’ face when he’s sitting at Starbucks or something on his iPad and he comes across—

Stephan: I'd like to see Steve Jobs' face when he's sitting at Starbucks or something on his iPad and he comes across—

Patrick: This means war!

Stephan: And he’s like “Are you kidding me?” (laughs)

Stephan: And he's like “Are you kidding me?” (笑)

Kevin: Well, what this shows — what this shows is that all of the stuff that people say you need Flash to do well— Well, maybe not all of it, but a lot of the stuff that people believe you need Flash to do well actually can be done well using web standards. And if an automated tool can convert these things into watchable Flash movies, well, watchable web standards ads, imagine what you could do if you were coding for the web standards from scratch; the kind of performance and slickness you could get out of it. So to some extent this is making Apple’s point for them, but for those people who work at ad firms and who for their entire careers for the past ten years have designed ads in Flash, this is the people they’re trying to rescue here with this.

Kevin: Well, what this shows — what this shows is that all of the stuff that people say you need Flash to do well— Well, maybe not all of it, but a lot of the stuff that people believe you need Flash to do well actually can be done well using web standards. And if an automated tool can convert these things into watchable Flash movies, well, watchable web standards ads, imagine what you could do if you were coding for the web standards from scratch; the kind of performance and slickness you could get out of it. So to some extent this is making Apple's point for them, but for those people who work at ad firms and who for their entire careers for the past ten years have designed ads in Flash, this is the people they're trying to rescue here with this.

Patrick: I mean I just thought of this as I was looking at this, but put aside ads for a second and think about all the video sites that are out there that maybe aren’t where they want to be as far as HTML5 or whatever standard they want to get to for the iPad, and how something like this could instantly make them compatible while they work on that solution. And every, you know, rich media sites in general, like how does this thing translate to Flash games I wonder. And those sites and all the sites that do rely on Flash it’s I mean a big deal beyond ads if it works well.

Patrick: I mean I just thought of this as I was looking at this, but put aside ads for a second and think about all the video sites that are out there that maybe aren't where they want to be as far as HTML5 or whatever standard they want to get to for the iPad, and how something like this could instantly make them compatible while they work on that solution. And every, you know, rich media sites in general, like how does this thing translate to Flash games I wonder. And those sites and all the sites that do rely on Flash it's I mean a big deal beyond ads if it works well.

Kevin: Hmm-mm. Definitely something to keep our eye on. At the moment it’s just a preview, they anticipate releasing the tool soon and they say at the moment it supports a subset of Flash 8 features. So it’s got a ways to go to be a complete Flash replacement, but certainly for the 90 percent case especially for advertisers this is a really impressive tool that’s going to change the game quite a bit I think.

凯文：嗯。 Definitely something to keep our eye on. At the moment it's just a preview, they anticipate releasing the tool soon and they say at the moment it supports a subset of Flash 8 features. So it's got a ways to go to be a complete Flash replacement, but certainly for the 90 percent case especially for advertisers this is a really impressive tool that's going to change the game quite a bit I think.

Let’s get to our spotlight guys. We’ve run a bit long so let’s blow through these so that we can let our listeners get back to their days.

Let's get to our spotlight guys. We've run a bit long so let's blow through these so that we can let our listeners get back to their days.

Patrick what have you got for us?

Patrick: Listeners have nothing better to do than listen to us, okay. No, I’m just kidding. No, my spotlight is called Social Mention, it’s socialmention.com, and I was turned on to it by Derek Brown at the Shift Conference in Greenville that I was at recently. Basically what it does is it searches some, I would say 60, 70 odd social sites, everything from what you’d expect, Facebook, MySpace, Twitter, to Google Blog search or Google Buzz mentions, Google News, and you can search for your brand or you can search for a term and it’ll search all of these sources for you in a pretty quick manner. And one thing that impressed me is their real time buzz widget. Now basically what that is, is you can embed on your site, think the Twitter badge for mentions that they give you on twitter.com or any mentions of a specific term you can display on your site. This is the same except it is for all these different platforms; you can have Facebook, Twitter, Delicious, FriendFeed, Digg mentions all on one page if you so choose. And it’s really powerful, fast loading, it works as it should, and I actually emailed the developer because Facebook wasn’t in the buzz widget and I wanted it to be; his name is John Cianciullo, hopefully I’m pronouncing that right, @jonnyjon on Twitter, and he got back to me within two days and added Facebook to the widget. That impressed me and it seems like it’s a really valuable person for anyone who wants to monitor a term or a brand in any social media context.

Patrick: Listeners have nothing better to do than listen to us, okay. 不，我只是在开玩笑。 No, my spotlight is called Social Mention, it's socialmention.com , and I was turned on to it by Derek Brown at the Shift Conference in Greenville that I was at recently. Basically what it does is it searches some, I would say 60, 70 odd social sites, everything from what you'd expect, Facebook, MySpace, Twitter, to Google Blog search or Google Buzz mentions, Google News, and you can search for your brand or you can search for a term and it'll search all of these sources for you in a pretty quick manner. And one thing that impressed me is their real time buzz widget. Now basically what that is, is you can embed on your site, think the Twitter badge for mentions that they give you on twitter.com or any mentions of a specific term you can display on your site. This is the same except it is for all these different platforms; you can have Facebook, Twitter, Delicious, FriendFeed, Digg mentions all on one page if you so choose. And it's really powerful, fast loading, it works as it should, and I actually emailed the developer because Facebook wasn't in the buzz widget and I wanted it to be; his name is John Cianciullo, hopefully I'm pronouncing that right, @jonnyjon on Twitter, and he got back to me within two days and added Facebook to the widget. That impressed me and it seems like it's a really valuable person for anyone who wants to monitor a term or a brand in any social media context.

Kevin: Cool. Stephan what have you got?

凯文：很酷。 Stephan what have you got?

Stephan: I have something called Safari Extensions, and since Apple’s kind of put the extensions part in there, into Safari 5, and not really made it fully supported yet, they don’t have a gallery of all the extensions out, so there’s a guy named Jonas Wisser, I think is how you say his last name, who put together a tumbler site called Safari Extensions, and it’s got a bunch of extensions that I guess he’s compiling as he goes, and the address is safariextensions.tumblr.com.

Stephan: I have something called Safari Extensions, and since Apple's kind of put the extensions part in there, into Safari 5, and not really made it fully supported yet, they don't have a gallery of all the extensions out, so there's a guy named Jonas Wisser, I think is how you say his last name, who put together a tumbler site called Safari Extensions, and it's got a bunch of extensions that I guess he's compiling as he goes, and the address is safariextensions.tumblr.com .

Kevin: Yeah, very nice. There are some nice ones in there already. And people are finding it rather easy to port extensions over from other browsers I found, so a lot of the really impressive extensions you know from other browsers are appearing on this Tumblog very quickly.

Brad what have you got?

Brad: In the spirit of all of our HTML5 talk I have a pretty cool HTML5 demo that’s called Visualizing the Stanley Cup. And basically it has all the teams, all the hockey teams across the top, and then as you hover over each team it highlights on the grid below which are all the years from 1927 up until 2009, and then it highlights the year that that particular team has gone to the Stanley Cup. And then the color of the arrow is actually based on whether they won or lost. So it’s pretty neat to actually hover over all the different teams and you can see who’s been pretty dominant, and then you can also see, you know, there’s like three teams that have been once and lost, so you really gotta feel bad for those fans. But it really puts the game in perspective; I’d love to see this for all the different sports, you know, baseball and football and soccer and everything. So it’s a pretty neat HTML5 demo.

Brad: In the spirit of all of our HTML5 talk I have a pretty cool HTML5 demo that's called Visualizing the Stanley Cup . And basically it has all the teams, all the hockey teams across the top, and then as you hover over each team it highlights on the grid below which are all the years from 1927 up until 2009, and then it highlights the year that that particular team has gone to the Stanley Cup. And then the color of the arrow is actually based on whether they won or lost. So it's pretty neat to actually hover over all the different teams and you can see who's been pretty dominant, and then you can also see, you know, there's like three teams that have been once and lost, so you really gotta feel bad for those fans. But it really puts the game in perspective; I'd love to see this for all the different sports, you know, baseball and football and soccer and everything. So it's a pretty neat HTML5 demo.

Kevin: Tampa Bay Lightning have only been once. They have won though and they were only founded in 1992. Way to go Tampa Bay Lightning.

My pick is ShowSlow, which is a site that for a while now has provided statistics about the performance of various websites. But they’ve released a new feature that lets you tell them to monitor your own website and send you updates about the performance of your site. This is especially important now that it has been revealed that Google is factoring in the performance of your site when ranking your site. So if your site is slow then your site is gonna lose search engine ranking, and so it’s especially important to monitor this stuff. And if you’re running your site on a shared hosting service you want to be aware of this. So even if you don’t make any changes to your site for several months it would be good to know if your web hosting service sneakily added a whole bunch more sites to the same server and negatively impacted your site’s performance. So showslow.com is where you go to check this out; there’s a write-up on this on ajaxian.com that alerted me to this new feature, so very, very cool feature. If the performance of your site is not something you’re used to actively monitoring it’s even more important now than ever.

My pick is ShowSlow, which is a site that for a while now has provided statistics about the performance of various websites. But they've released a new feature that lets you tell them to monitor your own website and send you updates about the performance of your site. This is especially important now that it has been revealed that Google is factoring in the performance of your site when ranking your site. So if your site is slow then your site is gonna lose search engine ranking, and so it's especially important to monitor this stuff. And if you're running your site on a shared hosting service you want to be aware of this. So even if you don't make any changes to your site for several months it would be good to know if your web hosting service sneakily added a whole bunch more sites to the same server and negatively impacted your site's performance. So showslow.com is where you go to check this out; there's a write-up on this on ajaxian.com that alerted me to this new feature, so very, very cool feature. If the performance of your site is not something you're used to actively monitoring it's even more important now than ever.

And that brings us to the end of our show. So thanks once again guys. Let’s go around the table.

And that brings us to the end of our show. So thanks once again guys. 让我们围着桌子走。

Brad: I’m Brad Williams from WebDev Studios, and you can find me on Twitter @williamsba.

Brad: I'm Brad Williams from WebDev Studios, and you can find me on Twitter @williamsba .

Patrick: I am Patrick O’Keefe of the iFroggy network, ifroggy.com, on Twitter @ifroggy.

Patrick: I am Patrick O'Keefe of the iFroggy network, ifroggy.com , on Twitter @ifroggy .

Stephan: I’m Stephan Segraves. I’m in Houston, Texas. You can find me on Twitter @ssegraves, and my blog is badice.com.

斯蒂芬：我是斯蒂芬·塞格雷夫斯。 I'm in Houston, Texas. 您可以在Twitter @ssegraves上找到我，而我的博客是badice.com 。

Kevin: And you can follow me on Twitter @sentience and follow SitePoint at @sitepointdotcom.

Kevin: And you can follow me on Twitter @sentience and follow SitePoint at @sitepointdotcom .

Visit sitepoint.com/podcast to leave comments on this show and to subscribe so that you get every new show automatically every single week. We’ll be back next week with one of our first interviews from Word Camp Raleigh, so stay tuned for that.

Visit sitepoint.com/podcast to leave comments on this show and to subscribe so that you get every new show automatically every single week. We'll be back next week with one of our first interviews from Word Camp Raleigh, so stay tuned for that.

The SitePoint podcast is produced by Carl Longnecker, and I’m Kevin Yank. Thanks for listening. Bye, bye.

The SitePoint podcast is produced by Carl Longnecker, and I'm Kevin Yank. 谢谢收听。 Bye, bye.

Theme music by Mike Mella.

Mike Mella的主题音乐。

Thanks for listening! Feel free to let us know how we’re doing, or to continue the discussion, using the comments field below.

谢谢收听！欢迎使用下面的评论字段让我们知道我们的状况，或者继续讨论。

翻译自: https://www.sitepoint.com/podcast-65-got-ie6/

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